Confederate Flag Music

[Hardcore Troubador]

Have been getting into some "southern-style rock" lately (2 bands in particular - Blackberry Smoke, and The Bottle Rockets).  The Bottle Rockets have a great song called "Wave that Flag" about the Confederate Flag that made me think of some of the denizens of this board...

 

[HSFBfan]

Just now, Hardcore Troubador said:

Have been getting into some "southern-style rock" lately (2 bands in particular - Blackberry Smoke, and The Bottle Rockets).  The Bottle Rockets have a great song called "Wave that Flag" about the Confederate Flag that made me think of some of the denizens of this board...

 

BlackBerry smoke is a great band

 

[Nolebull813]

Heritage not hate my brother 

[Hardcore Troubador]

2 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

BlackBerry smoke is a great band

 

That's great!  VERY few people up in our neck of the woods probably even know who they are!

[HSFBfan]

Just now, Hardcore Troubador said:

That's great!  VERY few people up in our neck of the woods probably even know who they are!

I'm sure of that. I'm a big fan of southern rock. I've also been around that flag a good percentage of time. Comes with country music and nascar races. 

[Horsefly]

4 hours ago, Nolebull813 said:

Heritage not hate my brother 

It's the flag of traitors and at the time the enemy of the United Sates.

 

 

[Bormio]

3 hours ago, Horsefly said:

It's the flag of traitors and at the time the enemy of the United Sates.

 

 

The South was also forgiven its treachery and reconciled to the rest of the United States.  Confederate veterans are considered US veterans.

[HSFBfan]

Just now, Bormio said:

The South was also forgiven its treachery and reconciled to the rest of the United States.  Confederate veterans are considered US veterans.

Also dont forget Arlington National Cemetery is Robert E Lee land. He could have taken his land back but decided to take the money for me. What the south did was not illegal at the time in which they did it. 

[Bormio]

Just now, HSFBfan said:

Also dont forget Arlington National Cemetery is Robert E Lee land. He could have taken his land back but decided to take the money for me. What the south did was not illegal at the time in which they did it. 

No he could not have.  General Meigs (also a Virginian) buried a good chunk of the Union armies in his front yard - specifically so Lee could never go home.

[HSFBfan]

Just now, Bormio said:

No he could not have.  General Meigs (also a Virginian) buried a good chunk of the Union armies in his front yard - specifically so Lee could never go home.

Yes he could have. It came down to paying th taxes on it which the us government would only accept the payment from a certain person who couldnt do it do to health so it went up for sale. And the us government seized it and made it what it is today Arlington national cemetery. 

[Horsefly]

8 minutes ago, Bormio said:

The South was also forgiven its treachery and reconciled to the rest of the United States.  Confederate veterans are considered US veterans.

Of course they were, the purpose was to reunify.  The US benevolence though in forgiving the treachery doesn't take away from the act itself. 

 

[HSFBfan]

1 minute ago, Horsefly said:

Of course they were, the purpose was to reunify.  The US benevolence though in forgiving the treachery doesn't take away from the act itself. 

 

The south did nothing illegal and Lincoln was completely out of line. Killed 600k Americans. And nobody says anything 

[Bormio]

4 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

Yes he could have. It came down to paying th taxes on it which the us government would only accept the payment from a certain person who couldnt do it do to health so it went up for sale. And the us government seized it and made it what it is today Arlington national cemetery. 

Lee was never going to return there with all those dead Union soldiers buried there and he was never going to dig them up.  Whatever legal rights he had were moot with the cemetery already in place.

[HSFBfan]

Just now, Bormio said:

Lee was never going to return there with all those dead Union soldiers buried there and he was never going to dig them up.  Whatever legal rights he had were moot with the cemetery already in place.

Maybe not but he could have. The land was the land of george Washington family. If he paid the taxes the land was his and the United states wouldnt have had it and so Arlington national cemetery never gets established. Lee ended up going to kentucky even though he never wanted to leave his name Virginia. He lived virginia which is why he fought for the confederacy. He could never turn his back on his home. The man was a great leader. Was educated at west point and there is barracks at west point named after him. 

[Horsefly]

7 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

The south did nothing illegal and Lincoln was completely out of line. Killed 600k Americans. And nobody says anything 

Both sides of any conflict feel justified in their cause and purpose.  Typically though, the winner dictates the narrative.  The south was never shamed in defeat, so they have been allowed to see their actions as heroic and patriotic.  

[Bormio]

4 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

The south did nothing illegal and Lincoln was completely out of line. Killed 600k Americans. And nobody says anything 

There is no “out” clause in the Constitution and the Union said the secession was illegal.  And winners get to write the rules.  But in forgiving the South, there was a recognition that the South was fighting for what it genuinely believed.  They paid a heavy price during and after the war, but were reconciled.

[HSFBfan]

Just now, Horsefly said:

Both sides of any conflict feel justified in their cause and purpose.  Typically though, the winner dictates the narrative.  The south was never shamed in defeat, so they have been allowed to see their actions as heroic and patriotic.  

It has to be heroic and patriotic. Protecting your way of life while doing absolutely illegal. And the United states was never provoked by the CSA in any manner

[HSFBfan]

1 minute ago, Bormio said:

There is no “out” clause in the Constitution and the Union said the secession was illegal.  And winners get to write the rules.  But in forgiving the South, there was a recognition that the South was fighting for what it genuinely believed.  They paid a heavy price during and after the war, but were reconciled.

Succession was not illegal until after the civil war. That's a fact. 

[HSFBfan]

https://www.history.com/topics/american-civil-war/secession

[HSFBfan]

https://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/06/02/how-the-civil-war-changed-the-constitution/

[Bormio]

4 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

Maybe not but he could have. The land was the land of george Washington family. If he paid the taxes the land was his and the United states wouldnt have had it and so Arlington national cemetery never gets established. Lee ended up going to kentucky even though he never wanted to leave his name Virginia. He lived virginia which is why he fought for the confederacy. He could never turn his back on his home. The man was a great leader. Was educated at west point and there is barracks at west point named after him. 

Lee was very controversial even at the time.  General Meigs and General Thomas were Southerners and stayed loyal to the Union.  Meigs lost a son in the war and despised Lee.  Hence the creation of Arlington - which was a fait accompli at the war’s end.  The Meigs family has had men in the armed forces till the present day.

[Bormio]

5 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

Succession was not illegal until after the civil war. That's a fact. 

Says who?  The Constitution was mute on the subject.  It was a matter of debate.

[Horsefly]

2 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

It has to be heroic and patriotic. Protecting your way of life while doing absolutely illegal. And the United states was never provoked by the CSA in any manner

again, only from the view of a confederate would their way of life be seen as worthy of protection and actions be heroic and patriotic.  This is how any side of a conflict sees things.

As an example, you don't think North Korea feels their way of life needs to be protected and they should be allowed a s a sovereign nation to use and maximize their resources as they see fit?  

[HSFBfan]

1 minute ago, Bormio said:

Says who?  The Constitution was mute on the subject.  It was a matter of debate.

You just said there was nothing in the constitution stopping it. They didn't do anything against it. The south had absolutely every right to break away. And again Lincoln overstepped his bounds. And you can have your belief and that is fine but you are not changing my opinion

[HSFBfan]

5 minutes ago, Bormio said:

Lee was very controversial even at the time.  General Meigs and General Thomas were Southerners and stayed loyal to the Union.  Meigs lost a son in the war and despised Lee.  Hence the creation of Arlington - which was a fait accompli at the war’s end.  The Meigs family has had men in the armed forces till the present day.

Idk what was controversial about him.