Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 9 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: This is a Coronavirus, but it is not a strain of the flu. <<<actually that's exactly what it is... Why will I get vaccinated when there is a vaccine out there? Simple: to me it would be worth the risk. The genetic difference among the different strains of flu, are far less that the differences between those different strains of flu and this virus. I have not had the flu in over 30 years, so I assume I am immune. I have no such assurance with this virus and have no intention being a sacrificial lamb. It you want to take the risk, it is up to you. I would advise you not to, but you are a big, educated man, so far be it from me to tell you what to do. You will have to make your own assessment. As for me, I am glad I am retired and don't have to put myself out there daily! That's all good... and you are a grown man too... Your opinions are all fine... But they seem to be based on exact opposites of fact... noted in red in the last two posts... PS. you don't really need a real reason to have an opinion...but it is nice to have one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 11 minutes ago, Horsefly said: Swine flu in the US from apr 2009-apr 2010 there were ~13K deaths in the US. Coronavirus has ~100k deaths in only about 5 months Total of all flu's last couple years? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, Troll said: Total of all flu's last couple years? So a single virus is being compared to all flus? Why? regardless of year compared the coronavirus doesn’t have a years worth of data to compare. Maybe better to compare the total US infections/deaths after the 1st 3 months of the flu season? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueliner Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 This is some funny ass shit, I tell ya. You gullible, scared, lame sad goofy fucks are determined to go down with this ship, aren’t ya? You’re just DYiNG (no pun intended) to have this overhyped cold virus be then end of mankind. Dig those heels in, douchebags. I’ve seen the data personally, spoken to people “in the know”, and see what I see in some dense places of CA. I can tell ya that you will be alone soon enough. But keep praying for the virus to win just to prove us wrong. Dumb fucks🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 3 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: We are clearly still learning about this virus, man. It's called novel for a reason. It's new on the scene and we are learning about it on the fly. <<<BULLSHIT they been working on strains of this for DECADES...with your tax dollars btw. Idk about that particular doctor, I'm sure if we look hard enough we can find someone saying hydrochloroquine is effective also. <<<Yes Stephen King in 1978 The R-Nought value for the influenza a and b viruses is around 1.3, which means that an infected person will likely infect one to two others. The novel coronavirus had an R-Nought value of as high as five early on, but with the applied measures dropped below 1 to bring the average to around 3 currently. It's not me guessing, anymore than it's you guessing. <<<< R values to not equate to how 'easy or hard' something is to spread....only an amalgamation of how many they think someone will 'eventually' infect.....this may even have more to do with external factors (living conditions of population etc.) than the actual disease.... This is a week old study vs. that old March stuff you have posted. I'll go with the newer study.<<<that's half your problem...if you know how to decipher and read, they are both 'true' and both slanted..., no need to discard the info from either... https://www.livescience.com/new-coronavirus-compare-with-flu.html Try gonging your ownself. <<<no need.... this encore is for you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 4 hours ago, Troll said: so what's different about this flu than all the others??? (that would cause you to volunteer for a needle with unknown consequence, where you never would have otherwise....and please don't tell me it's just what the 6 o'clock news tells you...) Troll, let me answer you in this simple fashion. I have never known anybody during the duration of my entire life that died from a strain of the flu. In 11 weeks of the Covid-19 assault on the USA, I have known directly, two people that have died from it. In addition, among my friends and my wife's relatives, they have known of, or were related to, at least another 9 individuals that have died from it. So, to me, it hits much, much too close to home. Perhaps, you acquaintances and friends, thereof, have not suffered similar fates? If that's the case, bully for them. As for me, I repeat: I am glad I am retired and, therefore, have much more control over the extent to which I must expose myself to others. I will continue to lay relatively low till there is a vaccine that I have confidence in, or a drug, or regimen thereof proves effective in treating it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 10 minutes ago, Horsefly said: So a single virus is being compared to all flus? Why? <<<All flus to all flus....as when one strain takes out the sick population, the others can't in the same season...this is an "eliminate the weak" disease....and the total numbers represent the most meaningful comparison... regardless of year compared the coronavirus doesn’t have a years worth of data to compare. <<and trying to compare there is trying to deceive or not having a clue... Maybe better to compare the total US infections/deaths after the 1st 3 months of the flu season? <<you appear lost 🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Troll said: Figures that you'd drift back into conspiracy theories and "dumbness." All coronaviruses are not the same, no matter what the conspiracy theorists you like to follow say to you. This is totally why I stopped debating over here for a moment again. There is a preponderance of the evidence and there is outlier junk stuff. You seem to be more inclined to run with the latter because it fits what you want to believe more than following where the preponderance actually takes you in an unbiased manner. I'll tip my hat to you and your gong again now. Can't debate with dense that posts months old articles and studies against what knowledge we have accumulated to date, while taking the oddball stance that this is anything other than a novel virus. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, DarterBlue said: Troll, let me answer you in this simple fashion. I have never known anybody during the duration of my entire life that died from a strain of the flu. In 11 weeks of the Covid-19 assault on the USA, I have known directly, two people that have died from it. In addition, among my friends and my wife's relatives, they have know of, or were related to, at least another 9 individuals that have died from it. So, to me, it hits much, much too close to home. Perhaps, you acquaintances and friends, thereof, have not suffered similar fates? If that's the case, bully for them. As for me, I repeat: I am glad I am retired and, therefore, have much more control over the extent to which I must expose myself to others. I will continue to lay relatively low till there is a vaccine that I have confidence in, or a drug, or regimen thereof proves effective in treating it. I know several that have died this season... I am also the highest risk there is... You are healthy and will be fine... perspective... PS: you would have confidence in any vaccine where the manufacturers are indemnified from any reprisal for neglect ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Troll said: PS: you would have confidence in any vaccine where the manufacturers are indemnified from any reprisal for neglect ? I would have no more confidence in the scenario you describe than I would if I were a meat packing worker who knew that my employer was indemnified if I contracted it and died as a result of being forced back on the job (I mean forced in the sense that I lost any claim to unemployment benefits and could not afford to go without a source of income). If any vaccine came with that proviso, I would be inclined to go to Germany or some other country in search of "the magic bullet." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 4 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Figures that you'd drift back into conspiracy theories and "dumbness." All coronaviruses are not the same, no matter what the conspiracy theorists you like to follow say to you. This is totally why I stopped debating over here for a moment again. There is a preponderance of the evidence and there is outlier junk stuff. You seem to be more inclined to run with the latter because it fits what you want to believe more than following where the preponderance actually takes you in an unbiased manner. I'll tip my hat to you and your gong again now. Can't debate with dense that posts months old articles and studies against what knowledge we have accumulated to date, while taking the oddball stance that this is anything other than a novel virus. So YOU never saw it before.... woopie! THAT happens every year with every new strain... How many strains of "COVID" have we seen in the last 20 years alone conspiracy man? BTW: Conspiracy site had a good note on 'conspiracy claimers'.... What is a conspiracy theory anyway? Sometimes the term is deployed against anyone who questions authority, dissents from dominant paradigms, or thinks that hidden interests influence our leading institutions. As such, it is a way to quash dissent and bully those trying to stand up to abuses of power. One needn’t abandon critical thinking to believe that powerful institutions sometimes collude, conspire, cover up, and are corrupt. If that is what is meant by a conspiracy theory, obviously some of those theories are true. Does anyone remember Enron? Iran-Contra? COINTELPRO? Vioxx? Iraqi weapons of mass destruction? During the time of Covid-19, another level of conspiracy theory has risen to prominence that goes way beyond specific stories of collusion and corruption to posit conspiracy as a core explanatory principle for how the world works. Fuelled by the authoritarian response to the pandemic (justifiable or not, lockdown, quarantine, surveillance and tracking, censorship of misinformation, suspension of freedom of assembly and other civil liberties, and so on are indeed authoritarian), this arch-conspiracy theory holds that an evil, power-hungry cabal of insiders deliberately created the pandemic or is at least ruthlessly exploiting it to frighten the public into accepting a totalitarian world government under permanent medical martial law, a New World Order (NWO). Furthermore, this evil group, this illuminati, pulls the strings of all major governments, corporations, the United Nations, the WHO, the CDC, the media, the intelligence services, the banks, and the NGOs. In other words, they say, everything we are told is a lie, and the world is in the grip of evil. So what do I think about that theory? I think it is a myth. And what is a myth? A myth is not the same thing as a fantasy or a delusion. Myths are vehicles of truth, and that truth needn’t be literal. The classical Greek myths, for example, seem like mere amusements until one decodes them by associating each god with psychosocial forces. In this way, myths bring light to the shadows and reveal what has been repressed. They take a truth about the psyche or society and form it into a story. The truth of a myth does not depend on whether it is objectively verifiable. That is one reason why, in The Coronation, I said my purpose is neither to advocate nor to debunk the conspiracy narrative, but rather to look at what it illuminates. It is, after all, neither provable nor falsifiable. What is true about the conspiracy myth? Underneath its literalism, it conveys important information that we ignore at great peril. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 8 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: I would have no more confidence in the scenario you describe than I would if I were a meat packing worker who knew that my employer was indemnified if I contracted it and died as a result of being forced back on the job (I mean forced in the sense that I lost any claim to unemployment benefits and could not afford to go without a source of income). If any vaccine came with that proviso, I would be inclined to go to Germany or some other country in search of "the magic bullet." We agree ... and that is my only main problem with vaccines... That horse already left the barn, and isn't coming back anytime soon... Let's meet up in Germany, and I'll buy you a beer 🍻 😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 The epidemiologists have never seen it before. It's more than a "new strain." It's a totally novel coronavirus per the experts at all of the mainstream infectious disease labs. It uses a new way to connect to human cells and replicate, and actually a way that none of the epidemiologists ever knew or suspected could even happen. It's not a new strain of a known virus. Hence the term novel applied by the big league experts. @TrollNo offense meant, but, your stance is irrational, and I don't have the will or inclination to chase my tail arguing with an irrational person as it pertains to this virus. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Troll said: 🙄 That’s not what THC said, he stated H1N1 specifically killed more than coronavirus. nonetheless, Once again, you are wanting to compare a years worth of flu data to 3 months of coronavirus. Maybe you and you’re tinfoils hat are the ones confused. 😆 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Just now, Horsefly said: Once again, you are wanting to compare a years worth of flu data to 3 months of coronavirus. Maybe you should stick to tinfoil hat, bogeyman posts. 😂 ignoring the most meaningful comparison... means you do not seek to truly compare... That's what most call ignorance.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Troll said: ignoring the most meaningful comparison... means you do not seek to truly compare... That's what most call ignorance.... You’ve said nothing, dunbass. You have 2 years of flu data you want to compare to a coronavirus season that hasn’t completed a full year. How many will die 9 months from now troll, does a second surge intensify or does it wane off entirely? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedZone Posted May 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 7 minutes ago, Troll said: ignoring the most meaningful comparison... means you do not seek to truly compare... That's what most call ignorance.... Just stop, man. Sheesh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 Just now, Horsefly said: You’ve said nothing, dunbass. You have 2 years of flu data you want to compare to a coronavirus season that hasn’t completed a full year. Who's the dumbass ??? The Corona started back in NOVEMBER .....same as the rest this season... So what you try to represent as 15 minutes ago, Horsefly said: Once again, you are wanting to compare a years worth of flu data to 3 months of coronavirus. is more than double that, and the entire season.... You ....bullshit posts.....ignore any real comparison....attempt to degrade when proven wrong....WTG 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 19 minutes ago, Horsefly said: That’s not what THC said, he stated H1N1 specifically killed more than coronavirus. For the added text above.... Don't give a crap what THC says.... nothing to do with what I said at all... you seem confused again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 6 minutes ago, Troll said: Who's the dumbass ??? The Corona started back in NOVEMBER .....same as the rest this season... So what you try to represent as is more than double that, and the entire season.... You ....bullshit posts.....ignore any real comparison....attempt to degrade when proven wrong....WTG 👍 people are still being infected, it’s season has not completed yet. Why are you so simple minded? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 57 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: The epidemiologists have never seen it before. It's more than a "new strain." It's a totally novel coronavirus per the experts at all of the mainstream infectious disease labs. It uses a new way to connect to human cells and replicate, and actually a way that none of the epidemiologists ever knew or suspected could even happen. It's not a new strain of a known virus. Hence the term novel applied by the big league experts. @TrollNo offense meant, but, your stance is irrational, and I don't have the will or inclination to chase my tail arguing with an irrational person as it pertains to this virus. Then stop saying stupid shit in responses... Those same 'epidemiologists' haven't seen next years variation either.... Happens every year... ...and it replicates along the same line as the COVID in 2002 and the COVID in 2012. PS: good that you think 'rational' is what you read in the papers.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 4 minutes ago, Horsefly said: people are still being infected, it’s season has not completed yet. Why are you so simple minded? Simple minded would be ignoring the simplest and most meaningful comparison... It could also be posting the above.... when trying to claim ignorance 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 11 minutes ago, Troll said: Simple minded would be ignoring the simplest and most meaningful comparison... It could also be posting the above.... when trying to claim ignorance Then compare and stop babbling, throw YOUR data out there so we can assess it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Horsefly said: Then compare and stop babbling, throw the data out there so we can assess it. Don't even have it...🤣... (You know it's not even relevant to the point, of which comparison is most meaningful, LOL) Now you will probably claim that some "way out loser tactic that makes no sense" 🤣 But the numbers will fall where they fall, I would expect an increase this year... Would also expect to be on the (slightly) losing side on those numbers. But if you don't even know what any "real comparison" is..... I would agree we are as blind as everyone else trying to jump to "conclusions" PS: I'll see if I can find it....probably have to source a couple different numbers together, as for some reason I have not caught that whole figure being tossed around...🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted May 26, 2020 Report Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 minute ago, Troll said: Don't even have it...🤣... As I expected, cya 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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