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18 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

You only support HCQ because Trump supports it. Can't make the decisions for yourself. 

I don't support HCQ....

that was decades of medicine 👍

any other questions?

🐦

 

PS: now you know why you are not allowed to make your own medical decisions without parental approval....👌

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13 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

You only support HCQ because Trump supports it. Can't make the decisions for yourself. 

Consider the following.  A young and ideological college student lets down her guard and attends an event where, because it was hot, made it uncomfortable to wear her mask, so she abandoned it.  Lots of people in close proximity, some masked, others not,  yelling loudly etc.  She isn’t truthful with her parents about attending this event and several days later both her parents get sick and guess what, it’s Covid.  The girl tests positive for the antibody.  

The mother has a really tough go of it but survives, although with some long term implications.  She had some underlying symptoms that suggested she should have succumbed to the infection.  The dad, reasonably healthy except for hypertension, succumbs fairly quickly.   One of them had been using HCQ, the other chose not to.  I’ll let you guess which one was taking it.  

Now to the daughter, who has become an emotional wreck.  Sadly, there is no vaccine for what’s ailing her.  I hope that the tremendous support she’s getting from her friends is enough to offset the guilt that is ravaging her.  She, like her father was, is outspoken when it comes to Trump.  She used to be outspoken about HCQ as well.

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36 minutes ago, On2whls said:

Consider the following.  A young and ideological college student lets down her guard and attends an event where, because it was hot, made it uncomfortable to wear her mask, so she abandoned it.  Lots of people in close proximity, some masked, others not,  yelling loudly etc.  She isn’t truthful with her parents about attending this event and several days later both her parents get sick and guess what, it’s Covid.  The girl tests positive for the antibody.  

The mother has a really tough go of it but survives, although with some long term implications.  She had some underlying symptoms that suggested she should have succumbed to the infection.  The dad, reasonably healthy except for hypertension, succumbs fairly quickly.   One of them had been using HCQ, the other chose not to.  I’ll let you guess which one was taking it.  

Now to the daughter, who has become an emotional wreck.  Sadly, there is no vaccine for what’s ailing her.  I hope that the tremendous support she’s getting from her friends is enough to offset the guilt that is ravaging her.  She, like her father was, is outspoken when it comes to Trump.  She used to be outspoken about HCQ as well.

If this is a true story, I pray for all involved. But, it would be a fallacy to use one scenario to demonstrate a point when there are millions of cases of people not using it and being fine. I understand where you're coming from and I actually found no problem with your story, but I cannot confirm that one such occurrence can justify the use of HCQ for everyone nationwide.

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1 hour ago, Troll said:

I don't support HCQ....

that was decades of medicine 👍

any other questions?

🐦

 

PS: now you know why you are not allowed to make your own medical decisions without parental approval....👌

You don't support HCQ but you just advocated for it...

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1 minute ago, ngdawg said:

If this is a true story, I pray for all involved. But, it would be a fallacy to use one scenario to demonstrate a point when there are millions of cases of people not using it and being fine. I understand where you're coming from and I actually found no problem with your story, but I cannot confirm that one such occurrence can justify the use of HCQ for everyone nationwide.

Yes it’s a true story.  My third oldest daughter played soccer from AYSO through a few years of club with the girl, and they went to the same high school.  I’ve known the family for years now.  

Thing is, if you know enough people on the front lines in the fight against Covid,  HCQ being a factor in a successful outcome is far from an isolated incident.  Remember, I have two daughters and a niece all working in Covid wards in So CA hospitals, so I get a lot of feedback.  I also hope every day that my wife never gets the call that one of them turns up infected.  All three have been using HCQ since two weeks into the crisis.  Where do you get your feedback?? 

Is HCQ a miracle cure, or can it prevent everyone using it from getting Covid? Certainly not, but I haven’t gotten any feedback that it has made a person’s situation worse. 

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17 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

You don't support HCQ but you just advocated for it...

you mean here?

 1 hour ago, Troll said:

trusting untested new technoloy without even appropriate trials

over something that has been successfully medically used in proven treatments for decades

is brilliant...

👍

 


I was only speaking to efficacy of a medicine...

If the shoe does not fit where you like it,

perhaps you are just babbling birdshit again 👍

giphy.gif

 

PS: again.... that is why your brain is not allowed to make medical decisions for yourself 🤣

 

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21 minutes ago, On2whls said:

Yes it’s a true story.  My third oldest daughter played soccer from AYSO through a few years of club with the girl, and they went to the same high school.  I’ve known the family for years now.  

Thing is, if you know enough people on the front lines in the fight against Covid,  HCQ being a factor in a successful outcome is far from an isolated incident.  Remember, I have two daughters and a niece all working in Covid wards in So CA hospitals, so I get a lot of feedback.  I also hope every day that my wife never gets the call that one of them turns up infected.  All three have been using HCQ since two weeks into the crisis.  Where do you get your feedback?? 

Is HCQ a miracle cure, or can it prevent everyone using it from getting Covid? Certainly not, but I haven’t gotten any feedback that it has made a person’s situation worse. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-8605817/More-100-Americans-died-taking-hydroxychloroquine-COVID-19.html

This is one of the sources. I've also talked with a few doctors across Atlanta (I'm an officer of a health club at my school) and none of them recommended HCQ. I've also simply heard a lot of resistance to HCQ because it's unproven. And I would honestly trust a vaccine made specifically for COVID than HCQ, which is used for malaria. Just my opinion on that last part. Also, one of my best friends' mom is a doctor and she strictly advises against taking HCQ.

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Just now, ngdawg said:

which is used for malaria <<<(for decades).

again..thanks for playing. 🤣

but you still are not allowed to make a stupid medical choice for yourself 👍

You would eat birdshit

and call it an untested cure 😝

giphy.gif

 

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1 minute ago, Troll said:

again..thanks for playing. 🤣

but you still are not allowed to make a stupid medical choice for yourself 👍

You would eat birdshit

and call it an untested cure 😝

giphy.gif

 

I was answering to @On2whls. Not you. So don't interrupt. 

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49 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

HCQ, which is used for malaria.

Wow, so all the people in the US that have been prescribed HCQ for many years live in malaria infected areas?  Nice to know.   

 

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Just now, On2whls said:

Wow, so all the people in the US that have been prescribed HCQ for many years live in malaria infected areas?  Nice to know.   

 

Again, there's no point of making something out of nothing. All I said was that HCQ is used for malaria usually. It was used initially for that purpose.

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21 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

Again, there's no point of making something out of nothing.

Then don’t.  

 

23 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

All I said was that HCQ is used for malaria usually.

Nice revision.

 

I’ll give you some advice.  Go do a little research and find out how it came to be that HCQ even came into the Covid conversation.  Be careful though, in the process you may find that a lot of things are what they seem to be.

 

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Just now, On2whls said:

Be careful though, in the process you may find that a lot of things are what they seem to be.

 

Ooops, my bad.  Exchange “aren’t” for “are”.  HCQ is obviously impacting my alacrity.

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8 minutes ago, On2whls said:

Then don’t.  

 

Nice revision.

 

I’ll give you some advice.  Go do a little research and find out how it came to be that HCQ even came into the Covid conversation.  Be careful though, in the process you may find that a lot of things are what they seem to be.

 

What I meant by not making something out of nothing is when I said HCQ was used for malaria, you somehow made a (odd) connection to malaria-infested places in the US. HCQ is used to treat malaria. My point was that I'd rather trust a vaccine whose intended use is for COVID than a secondary HCQ which was originally meant for malaria. 

Only 53% percent of Republicans are willing to take HCQ, which leaves some room for speculation too. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/hydroxychloroquine-covid-19-prevention-how-separate-science-partisanship-ncna1235834

Check out this article about HCQ. And try not to read it while biased.

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4 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

HCQ is used to treat malaria.

It is also prescribed for Lupus. 

 

7 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

Only 53% percent of Republicans are willing to take HCQ, which leaves some room for speculation too. 

I formed my opinion on HCQ in advance of Trump making statements about it based on feedback from healthcare professionals.  

 

12 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

Check out this article about HCQ. And try not to read it while biased.

Believe me, I’ve read everything I could find about HCQ and Covid, and nowhere have I found compelling data that suggests that HCQ is more dangerous than no other recourse. While in college, I had to write proposals for grants for the research doctor I worked for.  These proposals were always scrutinized to the nth degree, so I had to be aware of all angles.  I could analyze the article you referenced seven ways from Sunday but in the end, the message is the same.  There really isn’t conclusive evidence to fully support one position or the other.  I now personally know of three people who were struggling with Covid and ended up getting by.  In one case, the person had been taking it on a preventive basis, and in the other two it was a Hail Mary that seemed to work.  If I personally knew of a person that had a negative outcome and used HCQ, I would reconsider my view.

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1 hour ago, On2whls said:

It is also prescribed for Lupus. 

 

I formed my opinion on HCQ in advance of Trump making statements about it based on feedback from healthcare professionals.  

 

Believe me, I’ve read everything I could find about HCQ and Covid, and nowhere have I found compelling data that suggests that HCQ is more dangerous than no other recourse. While in college, I had to write proposals for grants for the research doctor I worked for.  These proposals were always scrutinized to the nth degree, so I had to be aware of all angles.  I could analyze the article you referenced seven ways from Sunday but in the end, the message is the same.  There really isn’t conclusive evidence to fully support one position or the other.  I now personally know of three people who were struggling with Covid and ended up getting by.  In one case, the person had been taking it on a preventive basis, and in the other two it was a Hail Mary that seemed to work.  If I personally knew of a person that had a negative outcome and used HCQ, I would reconsider my view.

Well, who am I to change your view? I guess it's "good enough" until it fails. I'm not a fan of it, but if it works for you and others you know, who I am to stop you?

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9 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

Well, who am I to change your view? I guess it's "good enough" until it fails. I'm not a fan of it, but if it works for you and others you know, who I am to stop you?

You’re on the right path now.  Always check out both sides.  

I do a lot of off road riding and a number of times I’ve been confronted on dirt roads by folks that had posted “private road” signs in the area, and referred to them as law.   Each time I politely suggested they call the Sheriff and let them arrest me if I was trespassing.  You know how many times they called the Sheriff?  0.  You know why?  Because I checked ahead of time.   

 

 

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6 minutes ago, On2whls said:

You’re on the right path now.  Always check out both sides.  

I do a lot of off road riding and a number of times I’ve been confronted on dirt roads by folks that had posted “private road” signs in the area, and referred to them as law.   Each time I politely suggested they call the Sheriff and let them arrest me if I was trespassing.  You know how many times they called the Sheriff?  0.  You know why?  Because I checked ahead of time.   

 

 

I always do check out both sides, but I can only support the one I believe in. That's how I pick which side to support. 

Cool story. Your point?

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17 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

Cool story. Your point?

Do I detect a little amber in your EA?

17 minutes ago, ngdawg said:

I always do check out both sides, but I can only support the one I believe in

 I go with what I know, or have seen demonstrated.  There’s a difference between believing and knowing.

I had to drop a lot of beliefs in order to learn.   

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21 minutes ago, On2whls said:

Do I detect a little amber in your EA?

 I go with what I know, or have seen demonstrated.  There’s a difference between believing and knowing.

I had to drop a lot of beliefs in order to learn.   

No, I just didn't understand if there was a deeper meaning behind that than "do your research".

I'm sure my beliefs will change, but they won't be so easily influenced. For example, efforts to convince me that Trump is very good won't do much to me. Just as what you said, "I go with what I know" and I know some things about Trump that I don't appreciate.

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1 hour ago, ngdawg said:

No, I just didn't understand if there was a deeper meaning behind that than "do your research".

There is a deeper meaning.   I've learned far more in the past 5 years investigating concepts that I would have written off in earlier years, than in all my prior experience which includes a BS in Biological Sciences and a Masters in Plastics Engineering.   I'm not advocating that you don't pursue whatever education you are planning on, but the science we are taught, doesn't provide all the answers.  The same goes for scripture, history, and politics.   Take stock of what you are absolutely certain of, and seek answers to the rest outside of what convention tells you.   You'll have to dig hard to find the real truths.   

 

1 hour ago, ngdawg said:

For example, efforts to convince me that Trump is very good won't do much to me. Just as what you said, "I go with what I know" and I know some things about Trump that I don't appreciate.

BTW, I'm not trying to convince you that Trump is very good.   His character flaws may cost him this time around.  

 

 

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