Bormio Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 Umm … no. Biden promises booster rollout 9/20. Fauci blathers on about it. Then they could not decide between 6 months and 8 months after the last shot - leaving patients and doctors confused as hell. Now the FDA and CDC seem to doubt it is needed and have not signed off on the need for boosters. And 2 FDA regulators resigned yesterday because of pressure from the administration on recommending boosters and vaccines for kids. Glad the adults are in charge. “Never underestimate the ability of Joe to fuck things up” - President Barack Obama 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 You can follow the "Science"... or you can blindly follow the "scientist". 🤔 And If the top two scientists in charge of the whole program, don't go where you like 😲 (and they follow "Science" over their own paychecks) there is always what's left of some gov agency to follow, after it has been politicized.... 🙄 PS: I'll just stick to the "Science"....🤓 BTW: One Should NEVER forget, that while you are trying to follow the "Science".... "Science"... has always been trying to follow "Mother Nature". (and is always a step behind) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 4, 2021 Report Share Posted September 4, 2021 19 hours ago, Bormio said: Umm … no. Biden promises booster rollout 9/20. Fauci blathers on about it. Then they could not decide between 6 months and 8 months after the last shot - leaving patients and doctors confused as hell. Now the FDA and CDC seem to doubt it is needed and have not signed off on the need for boosters. And 2 FDA regulators resigned yesterday because of pressure from the administration on recommending boosters and vaccines for kids. Glad the adults are in charge. “Never underestimate the ability of Joe to fuck things up” - President Barack Obama Clearly poor communication between the White House and FDA. I dont think there is any debate about the need. Did you see the Israeli study released yesterday on Pfizer? After 5-6 months protection "vanishes" was the bottom line. The FDA is not only wrestling with what to do with Pfizer but also Moderna. Moderna is making half doses available as a booster. They have not ever considered J&j yet. Then there is the logistics problem and the Delta specific booster. The goal is to get all Americans vaccinated and opening up a 3rd shot will complicate that in several ways. The resignations were not from pressure but rather they felt their authority excerpted. Apparently it was their arrogance more than anything that fueled the resignations. No doubt it is a cluster fuck with the FDA remaining ridgit to science and not having absolutes yet and the practical concerns of the White House. It appears "boosters" are warranted at 5 months but what we really need is what we don't yet have, a booster/delta targeted combination. Its a very tough decision as there is no best option available and all the data is not in. All I can say, look for the fall to make the current surge look like child's play. All the best 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 2 hours ago, noonereal said: I dont think there is any debate about the need. Did you see the Israeli study released yesterday on Pfizer? After 5-6 months protection "vanishes" was the bottom line. It appears "boosters" are warranted at 5 months but what we really need is what we don't yet have, a booster/delta targeted combination. Its a very tough decision as there is no best option available and all the data is not in. The Debate is not about the need ... the need has always been Herd Immunity. as dictated by Mother Nature. 🦋 People tend to forget that... ...when they speak of "Science". 🤓 PS: Sometimes people have a hard time accepting this ... but once you realize that containment is not an option... It's not very hard to understand 🙄 BTW: Not sayin' you are wrong about the need for science to chase that horse, once it has left the barn....🏇 but when you talk and aim "off target"... you will never achieve your true goal. 🤷♂️ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 13 hours ago, Troll said: The Debate is not about the need It was spoken to in what I quoted. You are correct, it is not about need. That is what I said. 13 hours ago, Troll said: as dictated by Mother Nature. 🦋 People tend to forget that... ...when they speak of "Science". Not sure what you mean by this. That you are anti-vaccination? Or do you consider vaccination dictated by Mother Nature? 13 hours ago, Troll said: Sometimes people have a hard time accepting this ... but once you realize that containment is not an option... I think you miss the point of containment, to slow the spread so we can keep hospitals from being over run and by us time to attain herd through vaccination. 13 hours ago, Troll said: when you talk and aim "off target" No idea what you think is off target unless your perspective is that of an anti-mask anti-vaxxer. Are you? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 34 minutes ago, noonereal said: It was spoken to in what I quoted. You are correct, it is not about need. That is what I said. We agree on need... ACTUAL TARGET is the issue... 34 minutes ago, noonereal said: Not sure what you mean by this. That you are anti-vaccination? Or do you consider vaccination dictated by Mother Nature? Consider me pro-both... and one that understands that Science is doing it's best to imitate Nature. 34 minutes ago, noonereal said: I think you miss the point of containment, to slow the spread so we can keep hospitals from being over run and by us time to attain herd through vaccination. I think you missed .... that I was the one who brought up "containment" As you attempt to misrepresent it. 🙄 Just Look ☝️👀 at your own mess here.... and remember..."slow down" = (as in EQUALS) "No Containment" 🤓 PS: Extra credit here tho.... if you can explain why there is a greater shortage of hospital beds, via unvaxed "Hero" Nurses, ....than unvaxed patients. 🤔 34 minutes ago, noonereal said: No idea what you think is off target unless you are an anti-mask anti-vaxxer. Are you? Posted pics of my Official WHO authorized Vaccine Passport in another thread... (That is over 50yrs old, with pages full...) PS: Where is yours ? 😄 And the "Idea" is quite simply....That "Herd Immunity" IS the target, when containment is not possible. 👍 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 3 minutes ago, Troll said: remember...slow down = (as in EQUALS) "No Containment" 🤓 This is not correct. Slow down has a subtle positive effect on containment. (unless I misunderstand your use of the word containment) Slowdown enables maximization of containment. In other words, minimizes disease so we can both function and work toward immunization without infection. 10 minutes ago, Troll said: can explain why there is a greater shortage of hospital beds, via unvaxed "Hero" Nurses, ....than unvaxed patients. It is assumed this is due to the enhanced safeguards taken by the heroes. Plus as we know, the lions share of the spread of Covid is at your dinner table. peace 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 5 hours ago, noonereal said: This is not correct. <<actually it is. Slow down has a subtle positive effect on containment. <<(RATES of failure) which are entirely separate, only show the failure in "containment" of anything (unless I misunderstand your use of the word containment) <<apparently Slowdown enables maximization of means you have totally failed containment. <<FIFY ☝️ 5 hours ago, noonereal said: In other words, minimizes disease so we can both function and work toward immunization without infection. No problem with Vax goals towards immunization... But That is certainly a false target If you can't recognize the entire other half of the puzzle....you know... which is what you are trying to emulate... and which is stronger. 🤓 5 hours ago, noonereal said: It is assumed this is due to the enhanced safeguards taken by the heroes. Plus as we know, the lions share of the spread of Covid is at your dinner table. peace Don't shoot the heroes... Especially the ones following "Science" ...Like everyone says to. 🙂 🕊️ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atticus Finch Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 I love how Bormio never supports or backs up anything he says. The guy who thought Donald Trump was a good leader and was, apparently, clear on his message now thinks that the Biden Administration is "confusing" people regarding a difficult issue that hasn't been completely hashed out yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 5 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said: I love how Bormio never supports or backs up anything he says. Proving all you can do is follow people around and toss turds 👍 PS: Nice flinch...👌 BTW: 💩 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted September 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 In Biden’s mind it was resolved. It was to start for all eligible adults on 9/20. Except it was not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 8 minutes ago, Bormio said: In Biden’s mind it was resolved. It was to start for all eligible adults on 9/20. Except it was not. Exactly. The FDA is not on board. That is what we are discussing, no? Me, I'd hand them out now. I know several folks who are jumping line now anyway. (the Pfizer same does, it all we have as of now) BTW, I know folks who got a third Modena, was a 3rd of Modena poke reviewed at all yet? Anyone know? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted September 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, noonereal said: Exactly. The FDA is not on board. That is what we are discussing, no? Me, I'd hand them out now. I know several folks who are jumping line now anyway. Everyone is a scientist now. Don’t want to hear anymore about following the science. Apparently it is “what I want it to be”. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted September 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 Pfizer 3rd dose approved for significantly immunocompromised. Not approved for general public. No 3rd dose approval for Moderna No data on mixing vaccines available 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 56 minutes ago, Bormio said: Everyone is a scientist now. Don’t want to hear anymore about following the science. Apparently it is “what I want it to be”. What on earth are you talking about? I am not advocating anything as you appear to insinuate. You my friend are just looks to find fault and vent at anyone who is not of your religion, I mean tribe. Ok, I mean cult. 😝 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 55 minutes ago, Bormio said: Pfizer 3rd dose approved for significantly immunocompromised. Not approved for general public. No 3rd dose approval for Moderna No data on mixing vaccines available I posted all this previous. My question was specific. I asked for how far along 3rd does Moderna evaluation has progressed. BTW, Moderna is producing a half dose as a booster. I mentioned this previous to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted September 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 11 minutes ago, noonereal said: What on earth are you talking about? I am not advocating anything as you appear to insinuate. You my friend are just looks to find fault and vent at anyone who is not of your religion, I mean tribe. Ok, I mean cult. 😝 I wasn’t talking about you specifically. People get ideas in their mind (on both sides) and think they know best. Then get mad if experts find otherwise. A oft-quoted saying in medicine “Nothing more dangerous than a little knowledge”. People have been led to expect a 3rd shot and there will be an uproar if not approved. BTW, people in my cult are a lot more fun than in yours 😜 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On2whls Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Bormio said: No data on mixing vaccines available I’ll let you know how it goes😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 5, 2021 Report Share Posted September 5, 2021 3 hours ago, noonereal said: Exactly. The FDA is not on board. That is what we are discussing, no? BTW, I know folks who got a third Modena, was a 3rd of Modena poke reviewed at all yet? Anyone know? 🤷♂️ ✌️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 6, 2021 Report Share Posted September 6, 2021 8 hours ago, Bormio said: I wasn’t talking about you specifically. People get ideas in their mind (on both sides) and think they know best. Then get mad if experts find otherwise. Absolutely totally correct. 8 hours ago, Bormio said: “Nothing more dangerous than a little knowledge”. True. A bit off subject but this reminded me: I was once accused of having white coatitis by an ER doctor, I became enraged and snapped back that I had caught it from incompetent doctors. Which was the truth. I would not be here today if I blindly listen to doctors as most do. 8 hours ago, Bormio said: People have been led to expect a 3rd shot and there will be an uproar if not approved. Yes, which is why I have now agreed with you that the White House and FDA did not communicate as they should have. I want the damned 3rd shot now. I will however wait and "do the right thing." I will wait until it is authorized and it is my turn. The Israeli study from last week was very sobering, protection "vanishes" after 5-6 months. So far, our CDC has always validated the studies from Israel, just a few months behind. 8 hours ago, Bormio said: people in my cult are a lot more fun than in yours 😜 They were in the past, I admit that. Today, things have changed. No one is very festive. peace out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Posted September 6, 2021 Report Share Posted September 6, 2021 1 hour ago, noonereal said: A bit off subject but this reminded me: I was once accused of having white coatitis by an ER doctor, I became enraged and snapped back that I had caught it from incompetent doctors. 🤣 1 hour ago, noonereal said: Which was the truth. I would not be here today if I blindly listen to doctors as most do. high priced consultants... ...are high priced consultants. 🤷♂️ 1 hour ago, noonereal said: Today, things have changed. No one is very festive. peace out! 🥳 No one real you mean ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imaGoodBoyNow Posted September 6, 2021 Report Share Posted September 6, 2021 IMG_0024.MP4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atticus Finch Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 On 9/5/2021 at 12:39 PM, Bormio said: Everyone is a scientist now. The irony here is something. Even people like you who claim to be doctors actually royally suck at their jobs. But when it comes to science we should definitely listen to you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atticus Finch Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 On 9/5/2021 at 1:39 PM, noonereal said: What on earth are you talking about? Bormio is a chump. In way over his head in every discussion even ones in his supposed field. But never lacks the snark to comment on every other topic with his usual paucity of facts and support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said: Bormio is a chump. In way over his head in every discussion even ones in his supposed field. But never lacks the snark to comment on every other topic with his usual paucity of facts and support. I love your disdain of everyone and everything in the world, truly but most folks are OK. This place has the pleasant habit of drawing the absolute worst out of people. That I like. It's why I can't stay away. Oh yeah, Bormio is a good guy, just of a different tribe than you or I. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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