De La Salle football player arrested

[Las Vegas_JC]

http://www.eastbaytimes.com/2017/10/20/de-la-salle-ygnacio-valley-high-football-players-charged-with-sexually-assaulting-carondelet-girl/

 

CONCORD — Sexual assault charges were filed Friday against football players from De La Salle and Ygnacio Valley high schools alleging that the two students raped a Carondelet High student last month, according to authorities.

 

Detectives presented their criminal case Friday morning to the District Attorney’s Office, which decided to charge both boys with sexual assault, the Contra Costa Sheriff’s Office said.

 

The sheriff’s spokesman did not identify the schools involved for the suspects and alleged victim, but a law enforcement source confirmed that the three juveniles were from those three Concord schools. All-boys private school De La Salle and its all-girls neighbor Carondelet sent home letters Thursday to parents addressing the alleged assault.

 

The two boys were arrested Wednesday evening and booked into Juvenile Hall in Martinez, sheriff’s spokesman Jimmy Lee said.

 

The sexual assault allegation was brought to investigators earlier this week. The girl claims the assault happened in late September in unincorporated Walnut Creek.

 

This is the second time in less than a year that a student associated with De La Salle’s famed football program has been charged with sexually assaulting a Carondelet student. In May, a freshman was found in juvenile court to have raped a student in November.

 

Thoughts?

[World Citizen]

4 hours ago, Las Vegas_JC said:

http://www.eastbaytimes.com/2017/10/20/de-la-salle-ygnacio-valley-high-football-players-charged-with-sexually-assaulting-carondelet-girl/

 

CONCORD — Sexual assault charges were filed Friday against football players from De La Salle and Ygnacio Valley high schools alleging that the two students raped a Carondelet High student last month, according to authorities.

 

Detectives presented their criminal case Friday morning to the District Attorney’s Office, which decided to charge both boys with sexual assault, the Contra Costa Sheriff’s Office said.

 

The sheriff’s spokesman did not identify the schools involved for the suspects and alleged victim, but a law enforcement source confirmed that the three juveniles were from those three Concord schools. All-boys private school De La Salle and its all-girls neighbor Carondelet sent home letters Thursday to parents addressing the alleged assault.

 

The two boys were arrested Wednesday evening and booked into Juvenile Hall in Martinez, sheriff’s spokesman Jimmy Lee said.

 

The sexual assault allegation was brought to investigators earlier this week. The girl claims the assault happened in late September in unincorporated Walnut Creek.

 

This is the second time in less than a year that a student associated with De La Salle’s famed football program has been charged with sexually assaulting a Carondelet student. In May, a freshman was found in juvenile court to have raped a student in November.

 

Thoughts?

If true it's very bad and I hope the guilty are punished.  I think how we treat women in our society is and should be a focus going forward.  

I don't know what the % are but way too many women experience at least some kind of sexual assault or harassment.  Im going to ask my Mother and 3 sisters what they have experienced.  I am a little nervous as to the response I will get.  

[maxchoboian]

14 minutes ago, World Citizen said:

If true it's very bad and I hope the guilty are punished.  I think how we treat women in our society is and should be a focus going forward.  

I don't know what the % are but way too many women experience at least some kind of sexual assault or harassment.  Im going to ask my Mother and 3 sisters what they have experienced.  I am a little nervous as to the response I will get.  

 

Sexual assault is horrible, and needs to be dealt with accordingly. More than once has it happened to a couple of my 5 sisters and 4 brothers. One of the assailants was confronted after a sibling reached adulthood later in life, and it didn't go well for the disturbed perp. Probably better if the courts handle it.

[On2whls]

As a father of 4 girls the allegations are horrifying.  Over the years though, I think we’ve all seen that it’s best to reserve judgement until all the facts are reported.

Hopefully the justice system works as intended and if the evidence indicates guilt, then appropriate punishment is assessed.

[HawgGoneIt]

Everything else aside, as you guys pretty well covered it before me. If the allegations are true...This is further proof that no school or team is safe from having kids screw up and ruin their life and that of others. 

[HawgGoneIt]

These kids slip through the cracks on us man. It's tough. Try to give them the best education you can, teach them all the life lessons that football can provide to be taught. Mentoring, and providing for them in other ways. Keeping them busy until 7,8,9 at night almost every night at practice, and they still will make time to screw it all up. 

Tough stuff man. I hope these allegations aren't true. 

[World Citizen]

3 hours ago, On2whls said:

As a father of 4 girls the allegations are horrifying.  Over the years though, I think we’ve all seen that it’s best to reserve judgement until all the facts are reported.

Hopefully the justice system works as intended and if the evidence indicates guilt, then appropriate punishment is assessed.

Good luck to you sir.  4 huh?  

[On2whls]

2 hours ago, World Citizen said:

Good luck to you sir.  4 huh?  

Yup. The last two at least watch football lol.

[Lamarfan]

I'd like to see what the perpetrators look like.

 

[HawgGoneIt]

5 hours ago, Lamarfan said:

I'd like to see what the perpetrators look like.

 

I bet you would.

Don't bring your crud from th OT forum over here to the Varsity side, man. You'll find yourself on thin ice, again. 

You call it truth, and I call it thin ice. Be careful. 

[Lamarfan]

7 hours ago, HawgGoneIt said:

I bet you would.

Don't bring your crud from th OT forum over here to the Varsity side, man. You'll find yourself on thin ice, again. 

You call it truth, and I call it thin ice. Be careful. 

I agree we should probably keep athletes crimes off of the regular forum.  And why do I always have to pay for other people's crimes that's what Art Briles had to do.

[HawgGoneIt]

1 hour ago, Lamarfan said:

I agree we should probably keep athletes crowns off of the regular forum.  And why do I always have to pay for other people's crimes that's what Art Briles had to do.

Do we really have to do this again?

I'm telling you now, that I'm not putting up with your bull again. You have to bring race into every single damn discussion on the board. You and Rab both. 

We've been letting you do your 'truth' tellin' on the other board. DO NOT BRING IT HERE. 

That should be the end of that. 

 

[Lamarfan]

1 minute ago, HawgGoneIt said:

Do we really have to do this again?

I'm telling you now, that I'm not putting up with your bull again. You have to bring race into every single damn discussion on the board. You and Rab both. 

We've been letting you do your 'truth' tellin' on the other board. DO NOT BRING IT HERE. 

That should be the end of that. 

 

I think you already saw where I agreed with you above.

[PrepGridiron]

I haven't responded to this, because there really aren't words to do it justice. Not a good look. If true, even worse. I dated a Carondelet girl, like every woman, they all deserve respect. 

[HawgGoneIt]

3 hours ago, PrepGridiron said:

I haven't responded to this, because there really aren't words to do it justice. Not a good look. If true, even worse. I dated a Carondelet girl, like every woman, they all deserve respect. 

It's definitely tough as an alumni or staunch supporter to accept that something like this has or could have happened. Us Colquitt fellas know about the feeling that comes with serious allegations or criminal charges made against a player. Like my other post up there about doing everything you can for some kids and still losing them to bad decisions or just mistakes in general. It kind of leaves you with a hollow feeling. 

In the words of Rufus, eventually you just have to accept what it is, "flush it" and move on. Assess whether there was something more you could have done as a "friend" of a program or alumnus and if so, try to implement the ideas that you come up with. There are just too many traps and dangers in today's word to have a solution for everything. 

[PrepGridiron]

Follow up article on the situation

http://usatodayhss.com/2017/de-la-salle-carondelet-second-arrest-football-player-rape-charges

[HawgGoneIt]

Great read, Prep. I figured you guys were probably doing all the mentoring and stuff that I mentioned before and this article confirmed that thought. Y'all ain't running no rinka-dink shit show over there. 

[Belly Bob]

7 hours ago, PrepGridiron said:

Follow up article on the situation

http://usatodayhss.com/2017/de-la-salle-carondelet-second-arrest-football-player-rape-charges

Thanks for the link.

I'm puzzled by two claims in the article.

First...

    "Both De La Salle players [arrested for sexual assault in the past year] were not on the team at the time of the incidents because they were ineligible due to academic difficulties".

The freshman committed the assault in November of 2016, at which time he was not on the football team. It's difficult to see why a case like that should reflect poorly on DLS in general or on the football team in particular, since the kid couldn't have received much of an education either from the school or from the football program, given how little time he spent as part of either institution. 

I wonder how long the other kid had been a part of the school and the football team. 

Second...

    "He [the freshman student who was convicted of sexual assault in May of 2017] faces up to 10 years of confinement, but minors are not sentenced..."

How can USAT report how much time the kid might serve if he can't be sentenced? My guess is that they have some non-sentenced-based procedure for determining when to let criminals out. But I don't see the difference between a sentence and such a procedure, especially if there is some basis for reporting that the convict faces up to 10 years of confinement. 

Any insight you might have would be much appreciated. 

[PrepGridiron]

16 hours ago, Belly Bob said:

Thanks for the link.

I'm puzzled by two claims in the article.

First...

    "Both De La Salle players [arrested for sexual assault in the past year] were not on the team at the time of the incidents because they were ineligible due to academic difficulties".

The freshman committed the assault in November of 2016, at which time he was not on the football team. It's difficult to see why a case like that should reflect poorly on DLS in general or on the football team in particular, since the kid couldn't have received much of an education either from the school or from the football program, given how little time he spent as part of either institution. 

I wonder how long the other kid had been a part of the school and the football team. 

Second...

    "He [the freshman student who was convicted of sexual assault in May of 2017] faces up to 10 years of confinement, but minors are not sentenced..."

How can USAT report how much time the kid might serve if he can't be sentenced? My guess is that they have some non-sentenced-based procedure for determining when to let criminals out. But I don't see the difference between a sentence and such a procedure, especially if there is some basis for reporting that the convict faces up to 10 years of confinement. 

Any insight you might have would be much appreciated. 

As to your first concern, I see your point, but there could always be more done to evaluate whether you are taking all measures to avoid these situations. Maybe DLS has to be stricter on their admissions, maybe they could do more for these at-risk students or as the article stated maybe they have more open discussion with Carondelet. 

As to your second concern, in California, if you are tried as a minor, you can be committed to the Department of Corrections, Juvenile Facilities up to age 25. 

[World Citizen]

22 minutes ago, PrepGridiron said:

As to your first concern, I see your point, but there could always be more done to evaluate whether you are taking all measures to avoid these situations. Maybe DLS has to be stricter on their admissions, maybe they could do more for these at-risk students or as the article stated maybe they have more open discussion with Carondelet. 

As to your second concern, in California, if you are tried as a minor, you can be committed to the Department of Corrections, Juvenile Facilities up to age 25. 

I'm all for throwing the kitchen sink at the problem.   If all this proves to be true, do any of us think that these kids didn't know what they were doing was wrong?  They knew before they acted just like they know now after the fact.  Or maybe they just know that they got caught.  Idk but it is truly sad how women get treated all over the World.

[Belly Bob]

1 hour ago, World Citizen said:

I'm all for throwing the kitchen sink at the problem.   If all this proves to be true, do any of us think that these kids didn't know what they were doing was wrong?  They knew before they acted just like they know now after the fact.  Or maybe they just know that they got caught.  Idk but it is truly sad how women get treated all over the World.

It probably depends on the details of the cases.

I think that consent is tricky, and it's possible for one person to feel like he's been given consent and for the other person to feel like she hasn't given it. And I'd imagine that navigating consent when it comes to sexual interactions is trickier the younger you are. 

There have been a number of fairly high-profile cases on university campuses over the last few years in which the guy believed that he didn't do anything wrong and the girl believed otherwise.

[World Citizen]

3 hours ago, Belly Bob said:

It probably depends on the details of the cases.

I think that consent is tricky, and it's possible for one person to feel like he's been given consent and for the other person to feel like she hasn't given it. And I'd imagine that navigating consent when it comes to sexual interactions is trickier the younger you are. 

There have been a number of fairly high-profile cases on university campuses over the last few years in which the guy believed that he didn't do anything wrong and the girl believed otherwise.

Oh I'm sure there has been a number of cases.  Universities are not exactly tackling this problem head on.  They are worse than the military imo. 

And I do not think it's a tricky thing to navigate consent no matter what your age.  I've been young too you know.  I know a lot of shit happens where drugs or alcohol are involved where things are not so clear.  Girls claim rape when they weren't or feel ashamed and then say things.  

But I disagree about any ambiguity on consent.  Guys may not believe they didn't do anything wrong But that doesn't mean they didnt.  

I assume you believe the older you get the less tricky it is to navigate consent, right?  What do You think older people should say to younger people to educate them?   

Is it about power or young (and a lot of old) people not being able to control they're urges?  

[Belly Bob]

2 hours ago, World Citizen said:

[...]

And I do not think it's a tricky thing to navigate consent no matter what your age.  I've been young too you know.  I know a lot of shit happens where drugs or alcohol are involved where things are not so clear.  Girls claim rape when they weren't or feel ashamed and then say things.  

But I disagree about any ambiguity on consent.  

[...]

When it comes to sex, consent is almost always given non-verbally and is rarely explicit, save for sexual encounters between prostitutes and johns and between actors in adult films. So there's a basis for miscommunication. 

Here's just one kind of case.

Suppose that a guy and girl are making out and that the guy starts to move towards intercourse. The girl never says no, but she doesn't want to have sex either. The two have sex. She regrets it, and the next day she comes to believe that she was assaulted because she didn't want to have sex and because she never said yes or anything else positive and explicit. 

From what I've read, these sort of cases aren't uncommon, especially if the girl has suffered abuse in the past. I don't understand the psychology behind it, but evidently girls sometimes freeze up or shut down in those situations, because the situation is so uncomfortable or, in cases in which the girls has been abused in the past, because of PTSD. 

So it can seem from the guy's point of view that the girl has consented to sex, since she never said no, and from the girl's that she hasn't, since she never said yes.

And as you say, booze can make things unclear. But with young people and sexual assault, booze is very often involved: someone might agree to have sex, but the agreement falls short of consent, because the person agreeing is too drunk to give it. But it may not be clear to the other person that she's too drunk, since people can seem more sober than they really are, especially if you don't know them very well.  

[Belly Bob]

On ‎10‎/‎31‎/‎2017 at 8:12 PM, World Citizen said:

Oh I'm sure there has been a number of cases.  Universities are not exactly tackling this problem head on.  They are worse than the military imo. 

[...]

I think universities are doing a pretty good job.

I know that it is very often claimed that 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 women will be raped in college, but that's false.

A 2014 BJS study https://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=pbdetail&iid=5176 (which is the gold standard for this sort of thing) reports that...

    1 in 52 (less than 2 percent) of female college students will be raped or sexually assaulted during their time in college, where "sexual assault" is defined so broadly as to include "unwanted touching" and "verbal threats". Incidents of rape are far less common than incidents of sexual assault, and far, far less common than 1 in 5. 

that...

    young women who attend college are less likely to be raped or sexually assaulted than young women who do not attend college

and that...

    incidents of rape and sexual assault on college campuses have fallen by more than 50 percent between 1995 and 2013.

That doesn't prevent the Washington Post and others from continuing to report on the rape culture epidemic on college campuses and the 1 in 4 or 1 in 5 number. 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/local/2015/06/12/1-in-5-women-say-they-were-violated/?utm_term=.fd04b7e65afc

Notice also that the Post article reports that those who participated in their poll "are torn over sexual consent".

[HawgGoneIt]

A bunch of hooplah!

 

It should be simple and cut and dried.

If a person is too young to understand consent then they are too young to be having sex. The easiest way to avoid being accused of rape is to outright ask. If she says no then game over. If you are "moving toward intercourse" without asking her, then you are setting yourself up for a rape charge. Simple stuff really. 

Our bodies will betray us as hormones take over and lead to the example of the female allowing intercourse but not really mentally wanting to. Guys use this "trick" a lot, to get what they want, whether the female really wants to or not. 

Just ask straight up and avoid the confusion.