Omaha Vol Posted October 15 Report Share Posted October 15 1. Santa Ana,CA Mater Dei 2. Las Vegas,NV Gorman 3. Duncanville,TX 4. Bellflower,CA St. John Bosco 5. Milton,GA 6. Houston,TX N. Shore 7. Bradenton,FL IMG 8. Hollywood,FL Chaminade-Madonna 9. Ft. Lauderdale,FL Aquinas 10. Mission Viejo,CA 11. Lakeland,FL 12. Corona,CA Centennial 13. Buford,GA 14. Severn,MD Spalding 15. Orange,CA Lutheran 16. Carrollton,GA 17. Baltimore,MD St. Frances 18. Miami,FL Central 19. Ft. Worth,TX N. Crowley 20. Oradell,NJ Bergen Cath. 21. DeSoto,TX 22. Humble,TX Atascocita 23. Draper,UT Corner Canyon 24. Hyattsville,MD DeMatha 25. Houston,TX Summer Creek 26. Concord,CA De LaSalle 27. Venice,FL 28. Miami,FL Norland 29. Chandler,AZ Basha 30. Plantation,FL American Heritage 31. Anaheim,CA Servite 32. Austin,TX Westlake 33. Danville,KY Boyle Co. 34. Peoria,AZ Liberty 35. Massillon,OH Washington 36. Cincinnati,OH Moeller 37. San Juan Capistrano,CA JSerra 38. Auburn,AL 39. Southlake,TX Carroll 40. Cuyahoga Falls,OH Walsh 41. Chatsworth,CA Sierra Canyon 42. Seffner,FL Armwood 43. Akron,OH Hoban 44. Chattanooga,TN Baylor 45. Ruston,LA 46. Owasso,OK 47. Bryant,AR 48. Highland,UT Lone Peak 49. Leesburg,GA Lee Co. 50. Douglasville,GA Douglas Co. 51. Bixby,OK 52. Allen,TX 53. Suwanee,GA N. Gwinnett 54. Coppell,TX 55. Irmo,SC Dutch Fork 56. Cocoa,FL 57. Brownsburg,IN 58. Miami,FL N'western 59. E. St. Louis,IL 60. Phenix City,AL Central 61. Loganville,GA Grayson 62. Folsom,CA 63. Ewa Beach,HI Campbell 64. Lehi,UT Skyridge 65. Denton,TX Guyer 66. Indianapolis,IN Lawrence North 67. Charlotte,NC Mallard Creek 68. Westfield,IN 69. Pinson,AL Clay-Chalkville 70. Alabaster,AL Thompson 71. Phoenix,AZ Brophy 72. Omaha,NE Millard South 73. Aledo,TX 74. Lakewood,OH St. Edward 75. San Diego,CA Lincoln 76. Wyndmoor,PA LaSalle 77. Matthews,NC Weddington 78. Philadelphia,PA St. Joseph's 79. Inglewood,CA 80. Wayne,NJ DePaul 81. Norfolk,VA Maury 82. Rancho Santa Margarita,CA Santa Margarita 83. Fairburn,GA Hughes 84. Dallas,TX S. Oak Cliff 85. Gainesville,GA 86. Longview,TX 87. New Orleans,LA Karr 88. Orlando,FL Dr. Phillips 89. Lake Mary,FL 90. Provo,UT Timpview 91. Austin,TX Lake Travis 92. Pittsburg,CA 93. Gardena,CA Serra 94. Euless,TX Trinity 95. Mililani,HI 96. Kahuku,HI 97. Gibsonia,PA Pine-Richland 98. Valdosta,GA 99. Prosper,TX 100. Indianapolis,IN Cathedral Just missed: W. Chester,OH Lakota West Waxahachie,TX Norman Park,GA Colquitt Co. Thomasville,GA Thomas Co. Cent. Greensboro,NC Grimsley Willis,TX Trophy Club,TX Nelson Ramsey,NJ Don Bosco Montvale,NJ St. Joseph Greenwood Village,CO Cherry Creek Mesa,AZ Red Mtn. Gilbert,AZ Highland Greenwood,IN Ctr. Grove Louisville,KY Trinity Katy,TX Texarkana,TX Texas Conway,AR Novi,MI Cent. Cath. Fayetteville,AR 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 16 Report Share Posted October 16 A team with two losses, one of which was to a team which was running-clocked by an unranked team, is #8 in the country. The disturbing trend of rejecting the evidence from games actually played in favor of imagined results continues. 🙁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 16 Author Report Share Posted October 16 31 minutes ago, badrouter said: A team with two losses, one of which was to a team which was running-clocked by an unranked team, is #8 in the country. The disturbing trend of rejecting the evidence from games actually played in favor of imagined results continues. 🙁 The way C-M is playing right now, they’ve earned it. Don’t worry, your Dreadnaughts will get their chance in the state championship against STA. We’ll see then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 16 Report Share Posted October 16 18 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: The way C-M is playing right now, they’ve earned it. Don’t worry, your Dreadnaughts will get their chance in the state championship against STA. We’ll see then. They've lost two games. They have *not* earned a top 8 national ranking. It is ONLY through imagined results that they could be ranked where they are. We should not be confused about what "earned" actually means. The loss to Ely- regardless of what we imagine would happen if they played again- has to severely diminish what they've "earned". The circular, self-fulfilling prophecy approach to rankings should end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 16 Author Report Share Posted October 16 25 minutes ago, badrouter said: They've lost two games. They have *not* earned a top 8 national ranking. It is ONLY through imagined results that they could be ranked where they are. We should not be confused about what "earned" actually means. The loss to Ely- regardless of what we imagine would happen if they played again- has to severely diminish what they've "earned". The circular, self-fulfilling prophecy approach to rankings should end. There’s nothing self-fulfilling about it. There’s a big difference between thinking DeSoto beating N. Crowley in a rematch then C-M beating Ely in one. DS over NC is not a guarantee, but C-M over Ely is. You would have to be a fool not to see the difference here. You’re not a fool are you? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 17 Report Share Posted October 17 23 hours ago, Omaha Vol said: There’s nothing self-fulfilling about it. There’s a big difference between thinking DeSoto beating N. Crowley in a rematch then C-M beating Ely in one. DS over NC is not a guarantee, but C-M over Ely is. You would have to be a fool not to see the difference here. You’re not a fool are you? Neither outcome you mention is a guarantee. But, that isn't (or shouldn't be) the standard we consider to rank teams from anyway. A loss to a mediocre team SHOULD come with a penalty in the rankings, REGARDLESS of what one imagines would happen in future hypothetical match ups. And this is widely and easily understood by all...when the results in question don't contradict the preconceived assumptions of the ranker. No one assumed Florida would win at Tennessee this past weekend. So, the fact that the way the game itself played out strongly suggested Florida was the better team who would win a future match up is easily disregarded. No one is jumping Florida over Tennessee or anything remotely close to that, even after UT was also coming off a loss to unranked Arkansas. We are to understand, in this case, that a loss is a loss and Florida can suck it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 18 Author Report Share Posted October 18 On 10/16/2024 at 8:21 PM, badrouter said: Neither outcome you mention is a guarantee. But, that isn't (or shouldn't be) the standard we consider to rank teams from anyway. A loss to a mediocre team SHOULD come with a penalty in the rankings, REGARDLESS of what one imagines would happen in future hypothetical match ups. And this is widely and easily understood by all...when the results in question don't contradict the preconceived assumptions of the ranker. No one assumed Florida would win at Tennessee this past weekend. So, the fact that the way the game itself played out strongly suggested Florida was the better team who would win a future match up is easily disregarded. No one is jumping Florida over Tennessee or anything remotely close to that, even after UT was also coming off a loss to unranked Arkansas. We are to understand, in this case, that a loss is a loss and Florida can suck it. Umm, yes it is. C-M would crush Ely if they played again. I have no idea why you don't believe that??? Losing to the mediocre Ely team would've come with a penalty if C-M didn't rebound and beat the next 3 top notch teams (AHP,Norland,STA) they played. I never assume anything when Tennessee plays Florida. The Gators have owned us for about 30 years now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 On 10/17/2024 at 11:09 PM, Omaha Vol said: Umm, yes it is. C-M would crush Ely if they played again. I have no idea why you don't believe that??? Losing to the mediocre Ely team would've come with a penalty if C-M didn't rebound and beat the next 3 top notch teams (AHP,Norland,STA) they played. I never assume anything when Tennessee plays Florida. The Gators have owned us for about 30 years now. Chaminade lost to Ely, which was its second loss of the season. And you (and others) have decided to completely disregard the loss, in favor of what you imagine would happen in other games that have not and will not happen. Meanwhile, there are undefeated teams with wins as good or better than Chaminade has that remain below them in your rankings. Last year's Chaminade team got a raw deal in the rankings because people decided that the Bishop Gorman result from the PREVIOUS SEASON - which came on BG's home field, after they had several weeks to prepare while Chaminade had much more limited time (without even taking into account the time spent traveling which BG did not have to do)- was rock solid, indisputable and certain to be repeated if the teams played 100 times. No one was willing to consider that the BG result was an outlier which wouldn't have been repeated. Yet, we are asked not to question that the Ely loss is really a "guarantee" that the result produced on the field was not the real result, but rather the imagined results of hypothetical games are the real results. I need a drink. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 20 Author Report Share Posted October 20 10 minutes ago, badrouter said: Chaminade lost to Ely, which was its second loss of the season. And you (and others) have decided to completely disregard the loss, in favor of what you imagine would happen in other games that have not and will not happen. Meanwhile, there are undefeated teams with wins as good or better than Chaminade has that remain below them in your rankings. Last year's Chaminade team got a raw deal in the rankings because people decided that the Bishop Gorman result from the PREVIOUS SEASON - which came on BG's home field, after they had several weeks to prepare while Chaminade had much more limited time (without even taking into account the time spent traveling which BG did not have to do)- was rock solid, indisputable and certain to be repeated if the teams played 100 times. No one was willing to consider that the BG result was an outlier which wouldn't have been repeated. Yet, we are asked not to question that the Ely loss is really a "guarantee" that the result produced on the field was not the real result, but rather the imagined results of hypothetical games are the real results. I need a drink. If you really think Ely would beat C-M now, then I am at a loss for words. What teams, that are unbeaten and ranked below them, have better wins than C-M? Even though C-M traveled to Vegas, BG still destroyed them. So, that result was hardly an outlier. SJB traveled and took down C-M this year. It doesn’t really matter today anyway. My Vols beat Florida and Bama in the same year. I’m in too good of a mood right now to argue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 33 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: If you really think Ely would beat C-M now, then I am at a loss for words. What teams, that are unbeaten and ranked below them, have better wins than C-M? Even though C-M traveled to Vegas, BG still destroyed them. So, that result was hardly an outlier. SJB traveled and took down C-M this year. It doesn’t really matter today anyway. My Vols beat Florida and Bama in the same year. I’m in too good of a mood right now to argue. I've offered no opinion on whether Ely would beat Chaminade a second time. I'm simply pointing out that they did beat them when they played, and that it's ridiculous that you are *completely* disregarding the result in favor of what you imagine would happen in other games that haven't and won't be played. We typically haven't approached the outcomes of games with "ok, you won that game, but I don't think you can do it again, so I'm better!" You might see that sort of bullshit playing NCAA video football against 12 year-olds. There are many reasons to believe that the BG blowout of Chaminade was an outlier. They were NEVER considered in the slightest by "experts". The result was to be accepted, prima facie, as proof of how the teams matched up. Moreover, the 2022 result was absolutely used to inform 2023 rankings. Yet, other results- which people didn't expect prior- are supposed to be understood as fraudulent and disregarded. I understand why Ely is not rated ahead of Chaminade. I think it's bullshit that several other undefeated teams remain below Chaminade because rankers decided to completely disregard the loss to Ely. This is all a concern of mine, not because my school isn't ranked in any particular place (I do not contest where you have my school), but because it's emblematic of a bigger problem throughout society: people are increasingly likely to disregard evidence or lack of evidence in favor of what they imagine is or should be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 20 Author Report Share Posted October 20 45 minutes ago, badrouter said: I've offered no opinion on whether Ely would beat Chaminade a second time. I'm simply pointing out that they did beat them when they played, and that it's ridiculous that you are *completely* disregarding the result in favor of what you imagine would happen in other games that haven't and won't be played. We typically haven't approached the outcomes of games with "ok, you won that game, but I don't think you can do it again, so I'm better!" You might see that sort of bullshit playing NCAA video football against 12 year-olds. There are many reasons to believe that the BG blowout of Chaminade was an outlier. They were NEVER considered in the slightest by "experts". The result was to be accepted, prima facie, as proof of how the teams matched up. Moreover, the 2022 result was absolutely used to inform 2023 rankings. Yet, other results- which people didn't expect prior- are supposed to be understood as fraudulent and disregarded. I understand why Ely is not rated ahead of Chaminade. I think it's bullshit that several other undefeated teams remain below Chaminade because rankers decided to completely disregard the loss to Ely. This is all a concern of mine, not because my school isn't ranked in any particular place (I do not contest where you have my school), but because it's emblematic of a bigger problem throughout society: people are increasingly likely to disregard evidence or lack of evidence in favor of what they imagine is or should be true. This isn’t some silly societal issue here. You’re acting like this is such an atrocity. There are differences between certain teams. For example, I’m not going to drop N. Crowley below DeSoto if they don’t lose. Do I think NC would beat DS if they had a rematch? Maybe, maybe not. Do I know if C-M would beat Ely in a rematch? Absolutely! It was a fluke upset. Sometimes those things happen. I’m baffled that you can’t see that C-M has, obviously, turned it around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 47 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: This isn’t some silly societal issue here. You’re acting like this is such an atrocity. There are differences between certain teams. For example, I’m not going to drop N. Crowley below DeSoto if they don’t lose. Do I think NC would beat DS if they had a rematch? Maybe, maybe not. Do I know if C-M would beat Ely in a rematch? Absolutely! It was a fluke upset. Sometimes those things happen. I’m baffled that you can’t see that C-M has, obviously, turned it around. Do you know who Chaminade's QB is? Tell us about his season 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 20 Author Report Share Posted October 20 1 hour ago, badrouter said: Do you know who Chaminade's QB is? Tell us about his season 😁 Didn't C-M's QB get injured early in the Ely game? Or, maybe before the game? Also, correct me if I'm wrong, didn't a MIami Central QB transfer in to Hollywood recently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted October 20 Author Report Share Posted October 20 7 hours ago, badrouter said: This is all a concern of mine, not because my school isn't ranked in any particular place (I do not contest where you have my school), but because it's emblematic of a bigger problem throughout society: people are increasingly likely to disregard evidence or lack of evidence in favor of what they imagine is or should be true. Just out of curiosity, how would you rank Lake Mary, Dr. P and Edgewater? Also, just to throw out another scenario, where would you put San Diego Lincoln and Las Vegas Arbor View in your rankings? I'm interested to see how your mind works..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 11 hours ago, Omaha Vol said: Didn't C-M's QB get injured early in the Ely game? Or, maybe before the game? Also, correct me if I'm wrong, didn't a MIami Central QB transfer in to Hollywood recently? Miami Central's top 2 QBs to start the season were Bekkem Kritza, a 2025 4* Penn St. commit, and Anthony McQueen a 2026 0* transfer from Booker T . Kritza was Miami Central's *starting* QB coming out of Fall camp, started the Kickoff Classic and started and played every single down vs. Lakeland. Lakeland stymied Central's offense and point total in a way which is basically unheard of, yeilding only six (6) points to Kritza and Central. Bishop Gorman never did that in three match ups. And Lakeland is a public high school outside of Dade/Broward counties. Dade folks were both shocked and pissed. Like most people, they also wished to find a way to be in denial of the game. So, despite having McQueen available for Lakeland and simply electing to not give him a single snap in the game, Central benched Kritza for McQueen. Now, a much more desirable narrative is available for Central: they can disregard the Lakeland loss on the grounds that Kritza is UNIQUELY terrible and was the whole reason Lakeland beat them, while McQueen- not given a single snap- was the answer all along. We need not litigate the appropriateness or significance of the decision. Just roll with it. That's what Kritza did. He transferred to Chaminade about a week before the STA game. Chaminade, we are to believe, is also a brand new team following the 0-2 start. The Lions are now at the top of Florida and a top 10 team nationally...and are led by new starting quarterback...wait for it...Bekkem Kritza. He was the QB for Chaminade when they beat STA. tl;dr: Lakeland's defeat of Central is meaningless because 4* Bekkem Kritza is uniquely terrible...and Chaminade is now a top ten team nationally now that Bekkem Kritza is their starting QB. 😃 * One of Chaminade's QBs looks to be coming back from an injury, so we'll see how the rest of the season plays out. But, Chaminade is probably looking at a maximum of one semi-tough game left to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 6 hours ago, Omaha Vol said: Just out of curiosity, how would you rank Lake Mary, Dr. P and Edgewater? Also, just to throw out another scenario, where would you put San Diego Lincoln and Las Vegas Arbor View in your rankings? I'm interested to see how your mind works..... Lake Mary and Jones have been seen as the top 2 teams from Orlando, with Edgewater and First Academy in the next tier. DP has surprised, and pulled off the upset of Lake Mary. They then got crushed by Edgewater...who's lost to Jones and TFA. It seems like those top 4-5 are pretty close together. But Edgewater crushing DP is an eye-opener. Edgewater may end up the best of the bunch by season's end. I haven't investigated Lincoln or Arbor View, so I'm agnostic as to where they belong. It is impossible to properly vet all of the teams worthy of discussion, or even to know who is worthy or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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