steeler01 Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 The most talented team is France, but can they play as a unit with the system the coach implements Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxchoboian Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 2 hours ago, DarterBlue said: It also does not help that to develop your talent, you have to play at the travel club level which can be quite costly and out of reach for many potential stars. It's become a country club sport here. Parents shelling out bucks for their kids to play in tournaments in San Diego and Raleigh and Houston and Long Island. 2-3 of these each year plus the other 10 months of leagues and in-state tournaments. Not to mention the cash parents are willing to spend on a coach who has an accent. My kids played competitive football, basketball, baseball, hockey, softball, swimming, and soccer. Soccer was by far the most expensive, which is silly considering it requires the least amount of equipment/facilities. The club soccer teams are largely made up of kids from well-to-do families, who unfortunately are afraid to question the emperor's new clothes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cracker Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 Pulling for Iceland! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 14 hours ago, DarterBlue said: We are going about developing talent the wrong way. I don't think this is accurate. In other words, we didn't fail to quality because we didn't have good enough players. Since December 2016, the US Men's team has only lost two matches. Yet they didn't qualify for the World Cup. It was a fluke within a qualification system that's too long and drawn out. Yet the soccer fanboys want to burn everything down because they're emotional. There's never been more talent in the program than there is right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 13 hours ago, DarterBlue said: We would have to change the mindset of Americans. The sport would have to be respected. Importing old, former European and South American stars to the MLS, while it may draw crowds and provide fans an opportunity to see them in person, does not do anything to popularize the sport among those that really count: young people. This is way, way, WAY wrong. Americans watch the Premier League more than they watch MLS. So importing those players to MLS would popularize the sport among young people. When Beckham's Miami team signs Ronaldo or James Rodriguez it will pop unlike them signing, say, Geoff Cameron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 13 hours ago, DarterBlue said: Until Americans take the game that seriously, the USA is probably condemned to be the kind of team that usually qualifies for the World Cup, but exits either at the conclusion of group play or in the first round of the eliminations. It is unfortunate, as there is an abundance of latent talent here sufficient to make the country a power in this sport. There are 320 million people in this country. We don't need a majority of Americans to like the sport to be good at it. And we are good at it. We made it to the Round of 16 in the last two World Cups. Somehow soccer fanboys whine that we're not better than that when, in reality, we only started taking this thing seriously in the late 1980's. Soccer will succeed in this country despite the efforts of the soccer fanboy intelligentsia who have tried at every turn to fuck it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 15 minutes ago, Goldmember said: There are 320 million people in this country. We don't need a majority of Americans to like the sport to be good at it. And we are good at it. We made it to the Round of 16 in the last two World Cups. Somehow soccer fanboys whine that we're not better than that when, in reality, we only started taking this thing seriously in the late 1980's. Soccer will succeed in this country despite the efforts of the soccer fanboy intelligentsia who have tried at every turn to fuck it up. We are not good at it at all. There is no reason why the USA MNT should not be live contenders for the final 8 each and every World Cup. But you and your mindset will ensure that we stay exactly the way we are: just a cut above pedestrian. For to not recognize that there are serious issues, is to never address them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 13 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: We are not good at it at all. We've won 2 of the last 3 championships in our Confederation. We've advanced to the Final 16 in the last two World Cups. We've lost two matches in the last 18 months. We're in the top 25 in both FIFA Ranking and ELO. The self-loathing among soccer fans is absurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 15 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: There is no reason why the USA MNT should not be live contenders for the final 8 each and every World Cup. This is what I mean. At the same time that you're arguing that we don't develop players properly somehow we should also be contenders for the Quarterfinals of every World Cup. (by the way, we were contenders for the quarterfinals in 3 of the last 4 World Cups) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 20 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: But you and your mindset will ensure that we stay exactly the way we are: just a cut above pedestrian. For to not recognize that there are serious issues, is to never address them! I can assure you that my mindset has nothing to do with anything that the USMNT program does. Now you're just erecting strawmen. I never said that there were no issues. I just find soccer fanboys like you do be insufferable and wrong about mostly everything. We've lost two matches in 18 months yet you want to burn the whole program down and write long thought pieces on player development. Get real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 3 minutes ago, Goldmember said: This is what I mean. At the same time that you're arguing that we don't develop players properly somehow we should also be contenders for the Quarterfinals of every World Cup. (by the way, we were contenders for the quarterfinals in 3 of the last 4 World Cups) Don't misinterpret me, sir. I am not arguing that as we currently are we should be contenders for the quarterfinals each and every time. I am arguing that if the program was run properly we should be contenders each and every World Cup. There is a big difference! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 3 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: Don't misinterpret me, sir. I am not arguing that as we currently are we should be contenders for the quarterfinals each and every time. I am arguing that if the program was run properly we should be contenders each and every World Cup. There is a big difference! Sorry but I trust my judgment more than yours. We went to 7 straight World Cups after failing to qualify for 40 years. We've won 6 Gold Cups since 1991. We've made it to the Semifinal of two Copa Americas. But the program hasn't been run properly. Sure, guy. If you say so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
954gator Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 3 hours ago, Goldmember said: I don't think this is accurate. In other words, we didn't fail to quality because we didn't have good enough players. Since December 2016, the US Men's team has only lost two matches. Yet they didn't qualify for the World Cup. It was a fluke within a qualification system that's too long and drawn out. Yet the soccer fanboys want to burn everything down because they're emotional. There's never been more talent in the program than there is right now. This 100% with qualifying. South American Qualifiers are the same. They play 2 games then wait like 3-4 months, play 2 games wait 3-4 months, etc. By the time the world cup comes along the team is completely different. Plus, their's no time to get used to the changes from players club teams to the national team, and a lot of times players don't play due to it being an important time for the club team. It's annoying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
954gator Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 2 hours ago, Goldmember said: This is what I mean. At the same time that you're arguing that we don't develop players properly somehow we should also be contenders for the Quarterfinals of every World Cup. (by the way, we were contenders for the quarterfinals in 3 of the last 4 World Cups) I'd say the US did well in the Copa America as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 3 hours ago, Goldmember said: Sorry but I trust my judgment more than yours. We went to 7 straight World Cups after failing to qualify for 40 years. We've won 6 Gold Cups since 1991. We've made it to the Semifinal of two Copa Americas. But the program hasn't been run properly. Sure, guy. If you say so. You have every right to trust your own judgment as I do mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJR89 Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 we are not losers who fall into this spell of soccer only. like almost the rest of the world ....we are doing quite well considering it is our 5th sport....i would venture with concussion issues haunting football....Lacrosse will grow even more in the next 5-15 yrs.....on another note...the fifa bribery charges are ramping up in the media......now the sun has an article............GO Germany and Iceland .... https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/6424808/fifa-investigate-qatar-2022-world-cup/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 2 hours ago, DarterBlue said: You have every right to trust your own judgment as I do mine. But my judgment has the added benefit of being rational (and right). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 Just now, Goldmember said: But my judgment has the added benefit of being rational (and right). I am sure that's what you think. But I believe you are detached from reality. The problem with soccer in the USA is low expectations. That is why you think we are doing well. The facts are we are a second tier nation. Now for some countries that would be great. After all, second tier is just below first tier and puts us squarely in the top 40 or so nations. However, given the talent and resources at our disposal that is mediocre. And that is where we will remain till there is a realization that changes need to be made or perhaps we will accept this fate since soccer is only our "fifth" sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 6 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: I am sure that's what you think. But I believe you are detached from reality. So far I've given plenty of facts to support what I'm saying. You? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 7 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: The problem with soccer in the USA is low expectations. No, it's not. It's soccer fanboy culture who thinks that progress is always linear. Fail one time and they want to burn everything to the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 8 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: The facts are we are a second tier nation. Now for some countries that would be great. After all, second tier is just below first tier and puts us squarely in the top 40 or so nations. We're #24 in FIFA Ranking and #25 in ELO Rating. So squarely in the top 30 based on every measure. But thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 2 minutes ago, Goldmember said: We're #24 in FIFA Ranking and #25 in ELO Rating. So squarely in the top 30 based on every measure. But thanks. Enjoy your weekend. Get back to me when the USA makes the final 4 for the first time. At that stage the program will have arrived! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 17 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: However, given the talent and resources at our disposal that is mediocre. And that is where we will remain till there is a realization that changes need to be made or perhaps we will accept this fate since soccer is only our "fifth" sport. The United States didn't have a full professional men's soccer program until 1988. Seven years later they were in the Semifinals of a Copa America. Fourteen years later they were in the Quarterfinals of a World Cup. But you claim that the program has been run improperly. Yet all you seem capable of doing is throwing out tired cliches like "changes" and "realizations" that are quite old in fanboy circles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 3 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: Enjoy your weekend. Get back to me when the USA makes the final 4 for the first time. At that stage the program will have arrived! So I give you facts and you respond with this nonsense. So to be top 25 we have to reach a World Cup Semifinal? Looney tunes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
954gator Posted June 1, 2018 Report Share Posted June 1, 2018 @goldmember I don't think the US is bad, but the US is accustomed to winning or highly competing in big sports at the highest level. Sure the US is good and can generally compete with very good teams, but they are inconsistent and lacking a bit when it comes to natural skill, and it is evident that the elite raw athletes in the US are not playing soccer. Take the #25 elo ranking (which is a good ranking), but when you think of the resources and athletes the US has they should be better, especially when looking at some of the teams with similar rankings. Here are the teams near the US according to Elo... T21. Iceland T21. Iran 23. Wales 24. Serbia 25. US 26. Slovakia My point is that these are countries that have no where near the manpower or resources that the US has. There is something missing other than just coaching IMO. For me it's cultural. Kids are kicking soccer balls when they're infants instead of playing catch etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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