And....DeMatha vs Mater Dei in 1983. NY Times article about the matchup between Wooten and MacKnight with photo!

[MD87]

2 minutes ago, Duckburghsfinest1987 said:

another thing, MD Basketball under McKnight, has a known reputation for their players transferring a lot in college, transfer at a high-rate, switch after their original school of choice after playing their for 1 year, and many speculate, say, their playing experience at MD factors into that a lot.

Could be.  It's actually fascinating how different the transfer culture is btw SoCal and NorCal.  AAU culture, too.  SoCal is a different universe.  Always has been.

[Duckburghsfinest1987]

Stanley Johnson definetley looks to finally be MD's first long-term NBA player, even if not a HOF-caliber player, but at least a long-term 2nd or 3rd-string player, its still a shock, raises eyebrows that it took MD that long to produce a player who has lasted this long, SJ has already played in more NBA games than any MD player under McKnight.

[CaliNorth]

18 hours ago, MD87 said:

Remember that team well.  Sleep walked over Newark by 14 or something.  One of the biggest mismatches ever, although the final score didn't reflect it.  That DLS/CW game was a classic, too.  Nail-biter the whole way.  CW's PG Chris Hernandez was a BALLER.  And then CW had to vacate that SoCal championship, and hasn't been heard from since.  Wonder what ever happened to Vance Wahlberg.  He had those boys (er, men the last couple of years 😉 ) ready to play year in and year out.  Dominated the Central Section. 

Man, those were the days.  The golden age of SoCal hoops really.  D-High, Chester, Fax, MD, Artesia, Poly, CW.  Of course Artesia became irrelevant with Merino's fall from grace (Artesia had some DUDES during those years!), along with CW and Wahlberg.  D-High's been done since the child molester got arrested, and Fax hasn't been the same post-Kitani.  Chester's still decent, but the LACS has dropped significantly.  SO different from the days of the Shaw, which then handed the baton (and its kids) to Chester in '98.  Poly's been irrelevant ever since then, too.  MD, of course, continued to rise to arguably its most dominant era of all with the two wins over Mitty and then the 4-peat with SJ.  But even MD now is in its longest state title drought in the McKnight era.  Those 90s/early 2000s were the days.

Honestly, same with NorCal.  OAL teams were ALWAYS tough, as were DLS and Allocco.  Other than JKidd's dismantling of MD in '92 and Mack's spanking of D-Hi in what, 2008, most of the D-1 title games were very competitive.  Now the OAL is dead, DLS doesn't have its moxy any more, and SC gets enough of the LACS and MD kids that it has no real comp any more.  Sad, but hey, what can you do?

I was wrong about Dela playing chester in finals. It was Fax . Yea, Dela had some really good teams under Allacco , but they don't get that elite b-ball player much anymore, if ever . I think MD has had some really good teams as of late , but the competition has gotten better also imop . Chino Hills had a couple of good seasons, sierra canyon, Bishop Montgomery , and even cen10 has risen to be equal with the likes of Etiwanda .  MD just seems to come up a bit short but still damn good. In Norcal , the OAL has pretty much disappeared from dominance like they once were . It's because of the exodus of the blacks in Oakland more than anything , at least as how it was explained to me from the Ex AD from Mclymonds . Sheldon, O'dowd , Salesian and MC seem to be year after year consistently the best . And if a player is truly elite, they all seem to transfer to an academy  like Jalen Green did his senior season 

[MD87]

1 hour ago, CaliNorth said:

I was wrong about Dela playing chester in finals. It was Fax . Yea, Dela had some really good teams under Allacco , but they don't get that elite b-ball player much anymore, if ever . I think MD has had some really good teams as of late , but the competition has gotten better also imop . Chino Hills had a couple of good seasons, sierra canyon, Bishop Montgomery , and even cen10 has risen to be equal with the likes of Etiwanda .  MD just seems to come up a bit short but still damn good. In Norcal , the OAL has pretty much disappeared from dominance like they once were . It's because of the exodus of the blacks in Oakland more than anything , at least as how it was explained to me from the Ex AD from Mclymonds . Sheldon, O'dowd , Salesian and MC seem to be year after year consistently the best . And if a player is truly elite, they all seem to transfer to an academy  like Jalen Green did his senior season 

It's been 10 years since I lived in the Bay.  Has there really been an African-American exodus like that from Oakland (e.g. like a similar exodus from LA to the IE down south)?  Interesting.  What about St Joe's?  Do you know what happened to them?  Their JKidd teams and the '98 team that lost to Chester were some of the best NorCal has put out, too. 

[CaliNorth]

27 minutes ago, MD87 said:

It's been 10 years since I lived in the Bay.  Has there really been an African-American exodus like that from Oakland (e.g. like a similar exodus from LA to the IE down south)?  Interesting.  What about St Joe's?  Do you know what happened to them?  Their JKidd teams and the '98 team that lost to Chester were some of the best NorCal has put out, too. 

The last time Joe's was elite in Norcal was when they lost to Dela in Norcal final in 2000.  They did win a lower division  4 title State title 3 or 4 years ago , but they can't compete with the bigger teams . Having said that , they did play in a great league with Salesion and St. Mary's , both of whom have won state titles . Yes , it is true , Oakland has seen a mass exodus of the black ball player . Those OAL teams for decades was a top breeding ground for future college and NBA players, and in other sports as well. I can't recall the last really good team out of there . I did see Oakland High play Dela in a playoff game some years back when they had Damon Lilliard , but I can't offhand recall the last serious contender out of that league

[Duckburghsfinest1987]

On 5/1/2020 at 5:53 PM, MD87 said:

Remember that team well.  Sleep walked over Newark by 14 or something.  One of the biggest mismatches ever, although the final score didn't reflect it.  That DLS/CW game was a classic, too.  Nail-biter the whole way.  CW's PG Chris Hernandez was a BALLER.  And then CW had to vacate that SoCal championship, and hasn't been heard from since.  Wonder what ever happened to Vance Wahlberg.  He had those boys (er, men the last couple of years 😉 ) ready to play year in and year out.  Dominated the Central Section. 

Man, those were the days.  The golden age of SoCal hoops really.  D-High, Chester, Fax, MD, Artesia, Poly, CW.  Of course Artesia became irrelevant with Merino's fall from grace (Artesia had some DUDES during those years!), along with CW and Wahlberg.  D-High's been done since the child molester got arrested, and Fax hasn't been the same post-Kitani.  Chester's still decent, but the LACS has dropped significantly.  SO different from the days of the Shaw, which then handed the baton (and its kids) to Chester in '98.  Poly's been irrelevant ever since then, too.  MD, of course, continued to rise to arguably its most dominant era of all with the two wins over Mitty and then the 4-peat with SJ.  But even MD now is in its longest state title drought in the McKnight era.  Those 90s/early 2000s were the days.

Honestly, same with NorCal.  OAL teams were ALWAYS tough, as were DLS and Allocco.  Other than JKidd's dismantling of MD in '92 and Mack's spanking of D-Hi in what, 2008, most of the D-1 title games were very competitive.  Now the OAL is dead, DLS doesn't have its moxy any more, and SC gets enough of the LACS and MD kids that it has no real comp any more.  Sad, but hey, what can you do?

I wonder which legendary MD Coach will retire first, Rollo or McKnight, another notable MD player who was very good, Schaea Cotton, he is another one who shockingly, didn't become a star after high school, he was very hyped up like LeBron was in high school. Longest state title drought of the McKnight era, that's interesting and unexpected. 

Crenshaw of L.A., I believe it's been more than 20 years since they last won a state title, I remember they used to be a beast back in the day, I believe they are the most decorated public school in California in basketball for boys, in 2017 and 2018, they ended a long title drought for CIF section titles, winning back to back, first time in over 20 years as well.

[MD87]

21 hours ago, Duckburghsfinest1987 said:

I wonder which legendary MD Coach will retire first, Rollo or McKnight, another notable MD player who was very good, Schaea Cotton, he is another one who shockingly, didn't become a star after high school, he was very hyped up like LeBron was in high school. Longest state title drought of the McKnight era, that's interesting and unexpected. 

Crenshaw of L.A., I believe it's been more than 20 years since they last won a state title, I remember they used to be a beast back in the day, I believe they are the most decorated public school in California in basketball for boys, in 2017 and 2018, they ended a long title drought for CIF section titles, winning back to back, first time in over 20 years as well.

The Shaw was 8-0 in CA state title games.  Legends.

[Duckburghsfinest1987]

2 hours ago, MD87 said:

The Shaw was 8-0 in CA state title games.  Legends.

I believe their former coach, Willie West, has been a nominee for the Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame, along with Gary McKnight, but neither have been enshrined yet. Anyway, MD currently having the longest state title drought in the McKnight era, the last thing you would expect for McKnight and MD. Maybe MD becoming a National Powerhouse again in Football, has had an effect on their Basketball program.

[MD87]

On 5/4/2020 at 10:02 PM, Duckburghsfinest1987 said:

I believe their former coach, Willie West, has been a nominee for the Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame, along with Gary McKnight, but neither have been enshrined yet. Anyway, MD currently having the longest state title drought in the McKnight era, the last thing you would expect for McKnight and MD. Maybe MD becoming a National Powerhouse again in Football, has had an effect on their Basketball program.

It's really hard to say.  I mean, the 90s (the first era of MD football dominance) were pretty kind to MD hoops, as well, with state titles in '90 and '95, and runner-ups in '92 and '99.  It really is a mystery to me.  Today's Sierra Canyon is good, but Chester, D-High and Artesia in the 90s/00s would have put a hurt on those boys, and yet MD still brought home titles in that era.  While MD rarely had the most talented team in the state, they still had better players, on average, than they've had the past few years.  Of course, had Bol Bol stayed, they probably would have brought home a state title or two; but then again, that's my point: they haven't had the type of marquis players (like Bol Bol) they've traditionally had over the years.  Sad.  It'd be great to see Gary get one more before he hangs it up.  (And had Devin stayed, he just might have gotten one in '21, with SC losing who they did.  Oh well, what coulda been....)

[Duckburghsfinest1987]

On 5/5/2020 at 7:58 PM, MD87 said:

It's really hard to say.  I mean, the 90s (the first era of MD football dominance) were pretty kind to MD hoops, as well, with state titles in '90 and '95, and runner-ups in '92 and '99.  It really is a mystery to me.  Today's Sierra Canyon is good, but Chester, D-High and Artesia in the 90s/00s would have put a hurt on those boys, and yet MD still brought home titles in that era.  While MD rarely had the most talented team in the state, they still had better players, on average, than they've had the past few years.  Of course, had Bol Bol stayed, they probably would have brought home a state title or two; but then again, that's my point: they haven't had the type of marquis players (like Bol Bol) they've traditionally had over the years.  Sad.  It'd be great to see Gary get one more before he hangs it up.  (And had Devin stayed, he just might have gotten one in '21, with SC losing who they did.  Oh well, what coulda been....)

also, I believe it's been said, why Taylor King's basketball career crashed, collapsed in college, is because he had similar issues to that of former MD athlete Todd Marinovich did. 

In regards to MD playing very well as a team, which makes a lot of their star players look better than they actually are, which is a major factor as to why MD players haven't been successful in the NBA or just become stars after high school, meanwhile other CA High Schools, who haven't won a fraction or a 10th of the amount of CIF titles, state titles MD has done under McKnight, have produced players who have made an impact in the NBA or after high school unlike MD players, my guess is because, those other CA high schools, the way their system worked, is that those star players, were basically a one-man show on their team.

For example, Klay Thompson of Santa Margarita, SM hasn't won a fraction of the amount of success MD has done under McKnight, yet they have proved a max-contract NBA player, and all-star player with Klay Thompson.

[MD87]

22 hours ago, Duckburghsfinest1987 said:

also, I believe it's been said, why Taylor King's basketball career crashed, collapsed in college, is because he had similar issues to that of former MD athlete Todd Marinovich did. 

In regards to MD playing very well as a team, which makes a lot of their star players look better than they actually are, which is a major factor as to why MD players haven't been successful in the NBA or just become stars after high school, meanwhile other CA High Schools, who haven't won a fraction or a 10th of the amount of CIF titles, state titles MD has done under McKnight, have produced players who have made an impact in the NBA or after high school unlike MD players, my guess is because, those other CA high schools, the way their system worked, is that those star players, were basically a one-man show on their team.

For example, Klay Thompson of Santa Margarita, SM hasn't won a fraction of the amount of success MD has done under McKnight, yet they have proved a max-contract NBA player, and all-star player with Klay Thompson.

Wow, never heard that about King, but sucks if true.  Todd was a year behind me at MD.  So sad.  Marv was a psycho.

[Duckburghsfinest1987]

On 5/7/2020 at 8:04 PM, MD87 said:

Wow, never heard that about King, but sucks if true.  Todd was a year behind me at MD.  So sad.  Marv was a psycho.

ya, I believe Taylor King is among 2 McDonald's All-American players from the West roster from the 2007 team that did not make it to the NBA.

[Bodysurf]

On 5/7/2020 at 11:04 PM, MD87 said:

Wow, never heard that about King, but sucks if true.  Todd was a year behind me at MD.  So sad.  Marv was a psycho.

Todd was in my class. Let’s just say Marv was an interesting strength coach😉