Harvard sinking

[I AM IRONMAN]

First plagiarism by President Gay…now the same for their Chief of DEI…And now they want DEI in their teaching hospital…. Yeah if I need critical surgery I want the best qualified doctors…not ones who slipped in due to DEI. #commonsense

[Nolebull813]

7 hours ago, I AM IRONMAN said:

First plagiarism by President Gay…now the same for their Chief of DEI…And now they want DEI in their teaching hospital…. Yeah if I need critical surgery I want the best qualified doctors…not ones who slipped in due to DEI. #commonsense

Discrimination, Exclusion and Indoctrination otherwise known as DEI is one of the fastest ways to a collapsed society. It will take crashes planes, botched surgeries, and military defense breakdowns to prove to the common person that it’s pure poison. 
 

Diversity at its most basic definition means to dilute and water down. Diversity should be strictly coincidental. If you had 30 kids taking a test, 10 white, 10 black and 10 Hispanic and you only have 3 spots available out of the 30, and only 3 kids got perfect scores you should obviously choose them. The race of them shouldn’t matter at all. If they just so happen to be one of each race purely by coincidence GREAT! That’s positive diversity. But if 3 white kid scored perfectly and you tell 2 of them they don’t qualify because you need the kids who got lower scores because of their skin color that’s called negative diversity and that’s the cases that could have catastrophic outcomes 

[Atticus Finch]

Yeah, totally sinking.

It's only coming up on the 400th anniversary of it's founding and has a $50 billion endowment.

How will they ever survive?

[Atticus Finch]

45 minutes ago, Nolebull813 said:

 It will take crashes planes, botched surgeries, and military defense breakdowns to prove to the common person that it’s pure poison. 

I'm sure your brilliant mind will be able to come up with standards with which to measure these things and it will be TOTALLY logical and even-handed.

But there hasn't been a single commercial plane crash in the United States since 2009. I assume that this happened at a time when diversity was running rampant, too!

In fact, there have never been fewer fatalities in plane crashes, botched surgeries or wars than there are right now.

It's a miracle!

Or it could be that nobody becomes a pilot because they're a black lesbian. Or a doctor. Or a military officer.

That's not how things work. You can either pass your check flights to become a pilot of you can't. You can either get through medical school and your clinicals or you can't. You can either get through boot camp and the requisite tests or you can't.

[Atticus Finch]

40 minutes ago, Nolebull813 said:

Diversity at its most basic definition means to dilute and water down.

Actually, there's no definition of diversity that means that. I'm pretty sure that you just made that up.

You purposefully misrepresent, lie and make-up things so that everything will cohere to your worldview. I mean in this thread alone you've managed to blame black people and Hispanics for future plane crashes that they will almost certainly have nothing to do with!

[941Indian]

40 minutes ago, Nolebull813 said:

Discrimination, Exclusion and Indoctrination otherwise known as DEI is one of the fastest ways to a collapsed society. It will take crashes planes, botched surgeries, and military defense breakdowns to prove to the common person that it’s pure poison. 
 

Diversity at its most basic definition means to dilute and water down. Diversity should be strictly coincidental. If you had 30 kids taking a test, 10 white, 10 black and 10 Hispanic and you only have 3 spots available out of the 30, and only 3 kids got perfect scores you should obviously choose them. The race of them shouldn’t matter at all. If they just so happen to be one of each race purely by coincidence GREAT! That’s positive diversity. But if 3 white kid scored perfectly and you tell 2 of them they don’t qualify because you need the kids who got lower scores because of their skin color that’s called negative diversity and that’s the cases that could have catastrophic outcomes 

Every single word of this is perfect. Personal example to expand on this and help illustrate:

2 years ago, when I had to have a minor surgery on my left kidney to remove a stone that couldn’t be passed naturally, my anesthesiologist and her assistant were both black. My urologist’s assistant was Hispanic. They were all extremely knowledgeable in their craft and helped ensure my general comfort and the overall success of the surgery.
 

We didn’t look at what color we were when I was in the most excruciating pain of my life and they were helping me power through it. I just knew they were good people; the best kind of people, in fact. They weren’t in those positions because of the color of their skin, they were there because they busted their humps to get through 8 years of medical school and scored very well on their board exams and certifications. And to me, that is a true success story! 

[Nolebull813]

17 minutes ago, 941Indian said:

Every single word of this is perfect. Personal example to expand on this and help illustrate:

2 years ago, when I had to have a minor surgery on my left kidney to remove a stone that couldn’t be passed naturally, my anesthesiologist and her assistant were both black. My urologist’s assistant was Hispanic. They were all extremely knowledgeable in their craft and helped ensure my general comfort and the overall success of the surgery.
 

We didn’t look at what color we were when I was in the most excruciating pain of my life and they were helping me power through it. I just knew they were good people; the best kind of people, in fact. They weren’t in those positions because of the color of their skin, they were there because they busted their humps to get through 8 years of medical school and scored very well on their board exams and certifications. And to me, that is a true success story! 

Love it. It’s the American dream personified. Like I said if you choose the best of the best and it so happens to be a diverse group, great! But to chose people not as qualified for a quota in counting skin color, that’s abhorrent and should be universally condemned. 

[Atticus Finch]

17 minutes ago, 941Indian said:

2 years ago, when I had to have a minor surgery on my left kidney to remove a stone that couldn’t be passed naturally, my anesthesiologist and her assistant were both black. My urologist’s assistant was Hispanic. They were all extremely knowledgeable in their craft and helped ensure my general comfort and the overall success of the surgery.

We didn’t look at what color we were when I was in the most excruciating pain of my life and they were helping me power through it. I just knew they were good people; the best kind of people, in fact. They weren’t in those positions because of the color of their skin, they were there because they busted their humps to get through 8 years of medical school and scored very well on their board exams and certifications. And to me, that is a true success story! 

How could the above story make any sense if you also said this, below:

20 minutes ago, 941Indian said:

Every single word of this is perfect.

What Nolebull813 said was complete nonsense which included made-up definitions of words.

[Nolebull813]

41 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

Actually, there's no definition of diversity that means that. I'm pretty sure that you just made that up.

You purposefully misrepresent, lie and make-up things so that everything will cohere to your worldview. I mean in this thread alone you've managed to blame black people and Hispanics for future plane crashes that they will almost certainly have nothing to do with!

I didn’t blame the recruits and students. And it wouldn’t be their fault if that was the case based on your made up scenario. The blame would lie at the feet of who made the decisions to hire less qualified individuals to meet some imaginary quota. 

[Atticus Finch]

1 minute ago, Nolebull813 said:

But to chose people not as qualified for a quota in counting skin color, that’s abhorrent and should be universally condemned. 

But since you just made this up then there's nothing to condemn.

There is not a single person who becomes a doctor because of their skin color.

This is mental illness personified.

[Nolebull813]

Just now, Atticus Finch said:

But since you just made this up then there's nothing to condemn.

There is not a single person who becomes a doctor because of their skin color.

This is mental illness personified.

You just made that up. You have no clue that they didn’t get hired based on skin color. DEI was literally created specifically for that reason. It is affirmative action on steroids. 

[Atticus Finch]

2 minutes ago, Nolebull813 said:

The blame would lie at the feet of who made the decisions to hire less qualified individuals to meet some imaginary quota. 

This literally never happens. Not a single person becomes a doctor because they're black. You just completely made this up so that you could whine about supposed DEI programs.

[Atticus Finch]

4 minutes ago, Nolebull813 said:

You have no clue that they didn’t get hired based on skin color.

You're making the charge so the burden is on you to prove that they do.

Since they don't, then you have no evidence.

Yet here you are lying and freaking out.

[Atticus Finch]

5 minutes ago, Nolebull813 said:

DEI was literally created specifically for that reason.

Yet another example of Nolebull813 knowing nothing about a topic and just vomiting word salads that he heard on Newsmax.

DEI was "literally" created for training purposes. Like those boring sexual harassment trainings that we've probably all had to endure.

Again, not a single person has ever become a pilot or doctor because they were black or lesbian or whatever.

Complete nonsense from start to finish.

[concha]

 

The People's Republic of Oregon recently removed the need to pass a basic skills test to obtain a high school diploma. 

Since Oregon abandoned its essential skill requirements for high schoolers, graduation rates have skyrocketed. With a graduation rate of 81.3 percent, Oregon’s class of 2022 set a record for the second highest four-year graduation rate ever recorded in the state. Unfortunately, this is not indicative of student skills. Only 43 percent of students in that year’s graduating class were proficient in English, and less than 31 percent were proficient in math.  

 

60% to 70% of students released to the real world lacking basic skills.  This taints basically all students in the state, since the diplomas guarantee nothing other than maybe a student was enrolled through high school.  Reading? Math skills? We don't need no stinking reading or math skills.

 

That said, compared to the results from government schools in places like Baltimore, those results are spectacularly good. 

 

Look at the below.  The differences in what goes into our medical schools are huge. If you had a serious condition and had to choose between a doctor named Lin or Wong, and one named Lopez, knowing nothing else about them which would you choose?

 

 

[Atticus Finch]

We're dealing with concha here so there's a lot of deception to unpack.

First, there's no link to the article that he's citing but there were a couple of hyperlinks embedded in the text so, like a crazy person, I actually read them.

This article states that the relaxing of testing requirements was merely a pause to assess the impacts of said testing.

Senate Bill 744 put a pause on graduation testing requirements for the next few years, allowing officials to review its impacts. But the state maintains that Oregon still has some of the most stringent high school credit requirements in the nation.

So not some liberal plot to lower the bar as I'm sure concha was insinuating.

[Atticus Finch]

Also, why would concha use graduation rates vs. proficiency levels instead of proficiency levels vs. previous proficiency levels? Well, because he's being deceptive and he's pushing a narrative.

Senate Bill 744 was passed in 2021 and implemented starting with the class of 2022.

This article states that proficiency in two of the three measurements *increased* from the class of 2022 to the class of 2023.

The Oregon Department of Education’s latest report on the 2022-23 statewide assessment shows that students’ test results improved from the previous school year, but more progress is needed in order for results to meet pre-pandemic levels.

Last school year, about 43% of Oregon students were proficient in English Language Arts, 30.6% were proficient in mathematics and 29.4% were proficient in science. While math and science saw a 0.2% and 0.1% increase from the 2021-22 school year, ELA saw a 0.6% decrease.

What's more is that if you just look at Portland Public Schools, which I assume concha thinks is the capital of the "People's Republic of Oregon", the proficiency rates are even higher and increasing in *all* measurements.

Oregon’s largest school district, Portland Public Schools, saw similar trends. Across the district, students’ ELA proficiency grew from 54.7% to 55.4% over the past two school years. Math proficiency grew from 43.8% to 46.2%, and science proficiency grew from 38.1% to 40.5%

[concha]

5 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

We're dealing with concha here so there's a lot of deception to unpack.

First, there's no link to the article that he's citing but there were a couple of hyperlinks embedded in the text so, like a crazy person, I actually read them.

This article states that the relaxing of testing requirements was merely a pause to assess the impacts of said testing.

Senate Bill 744 put a pause on graduation testing requirements for the next few years, allowing officials to review its impacts. But the state maintains that Oregon still has some of the most stringent high school credit requirements in the nation.

So not some liberal plot to lower the bar as I'm sure concha was insinuating.

 

Well, not sure where Andy got that quote, but it isn't from the article I was reading.

https://thehill.com/opinion/education/4288044-oregon-just-dropped-all-graduation-standards-failing-all-of-its-students-in-the-name-of-equity/

Oregon just dropped all graduation standards, failing all of its students in the name of ‘equity’

BY AARON WITHE, OPINION CONTRIBUTOR - 11/02/23 8:00 AM ET

 

In public education’s latest blunder, the Oregon Department of Education has just decided that basic reading, writing and math skills are not required for students to graduate with a high school diploma.  

Prior to the passage of Senate Bill 744 in the Oregon Legislative Assembly’s 2021 session, the state’s “Assessment of Essential Skills” requirement for high school graduation was sensible: “read and comprehend a variety of text, write clearly and accurately,” and “apply mathematics in a variety of settings.” Students were required to demonstrate these skills by “earning at or above a cut score on the Oregon Statewide Summative Assessment test.” 

Citing the effects of COVID-19 school closures, however, SB 744 required the state to review “requirements for high school diploma options.” To address learning-loss throughout the pandemic, the bill led to the suspension of Oregon’s essential skills proficiency requirement through the 2023-24 school year.  

Last month, Oregon’s State Board of Education voted unanimously to adopt an additional extension of this suspension through the 2027-28 school year. Board members, alongside Oregon Department of Education leadership, argued that requiring students to complete standardized tests both presented a “harmful hurdle for historically marginalized students” and represents a misuse of state tests. 

The Oregon Education Association (OEA), the union representing more than 40,000 teachers throughout the state, is a like-minded opponent of standardized testing. “Standardized tests are inaccurate, inequitable, and don’t accurately measure student learning and growth,” it declares. Further, the union labels standardized tests like Oregon’s Statewide Summative Assessment as “instruments of racism and a biased system.” 

With this in mind, the OEA’s role in the development of SB 744 is unsurprising. The OEA Special Education Committee “helped to develop…and helped OEA pass…Senate Bill 744 during the last legislative session.” Further, the union brags that SB 744 “passed with OEA member support in the 2021 session” due to “several equity concerns” surrounding Oregon’s essential skill requirements.  

Since Oregon abandoned its essential skill requirements for high schoolers, graduation rates have skyrocketed. With a graduation rate of 81.3 percent, Oregon’s class of 2022 set a record for the second highest four-year graduation rate ever recorded in the state. Unfortunately, this is not indicative of student skills. Only 43 percent of students in that year’s graduating class were proficient in English, and less than 31 percent were proficient in math.  

The OEA’s mission statement is clear. In addition to representing its members, the union makes a commitment to “ensure quality public education for students in Oregon.” By advocating for policies that do not require students to learn basic language and math skills in order to graduate, the OEA, alongside the State Board of Education, has placed Oregonian graduates at a significant disadvantage while substantially lowering the quality of public education. 

The OEA’s falling membership rate — down 4.4 percent from 2020 to 2022 — indicates that teachers in Oregon have begun to realize the destructive impact of teachers’ unions that consistently prioritize ideology over the success of teachers and students.

As Oregon considers additional changes to public education, parents and teachers should hold the state accountable while paying close attention to groups like the OEA, which are not only complicit in but actively contributing to the bleak future of public education in their state. 

 

[Atticus Finch]

Finally, concha laments the lack of "basic skills" among Oregon high school students but that's not what the tests are measuring.

Again, according to this article, the test assesses whether they are on track to be college and career ready which is certainly not just "basic skills."

The summative tests determine whether students from the third grade to the 12th grade are proficient, or “on track to be college and career ready,” by their high school graduation.

[concha]

7 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

Also, why would concha use graduation rates vs. proficiency levels instead of proficiency levels vs. previous proficiency levels? Well, because he's being deceptive and he's pushing a narrative.

Senate Bill 744 was passed in 2021 and implemented starting with the class of 2022.

This article states that proficiency in two of the three measurements *increased* from the class of 2022 to the class of 2023.

The Oregon Department of Education’s latest report on the 2022-23 statewide assessment shows that students’ test results improved from the previous school year, but more progress is needed in order for results to meet pre-pandemic levels.

Last school year, about 43% of Oregon students were proficient in English Language Arts, 30.6% were proficient in mathematics and 29.4% were proficient in science. While math and science saw a 0.2% and 0.1% increase from the 2021-22 school year, ELA saw a 0.6% decrease.

What's more is that if you just look at Portland Public Schools, which I assume concha thinks is the capital of the "People's Republic of Oregon", the proficiency rates are even higher and increasing in *all* measurements.

Oregon’s largest school district, Portland Public Schools, saw similar trends. Across the district, students’ ELA proficiency grew from 54.7% to 55.4% over the past two school years. Math proficiency grew from 43.8% to 46.2%, and science proficiency grew from 38.1% to 40.5%

 

This should not be difficult to understand.

Except for Andy, of course. Who will try to throw up chaff and distractions from the central point:

Why are high school diplomas handed out to students who lack basic language and math skills?

 

[Atticus Finch]

3 minutes ago, concha said:

Well, not sure where Andy got that quote, but it isn't from the article I was reading.

Right, because you didn't provide it. As I said. Then I clicked the two hyperlinks that were embedded in your text. Those are the articles I cited.

It's as if you don't read anything and just charge forward with your preconceived agenda.

[Atticus Finch]

1 minute ago, concha said:

Why are high school diplomas handed out to students who lack basic language and math skills?

Because they're not measuring for basic skills. You'd know that if you actually read the articles that you cite.

👇

3 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

Finally, concha laments the lack of "basic skills" among Oregon high school students but that's not what the tests are measuring.

Again, according to this article, the test assesses whether they are on track to be college and career ready which is certainly not just "basic skills."

The summative tests determine whether students from the third grade to the 12th grade are proficient, or “on track to be college and career ready,” by their high school graduation.

 

[Atticus Finch]

These exercises are always comical when concha is involved.

He goes after Oregon because ostensibly they're a liberal state that he can rail against but the results show that scores have improved in two of the three measures since they paused testing. What's more is that in the liberal parts of the state, the scores improved across the board.

Testing doesn't cause proficiency. It's a ridiculous argument.

We won't hold out breath waiting for a concha screed against the grotesque education systems in places like Mississippi or Arkansas because they'll never come.

[concha]

8 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

Finally, concha laments the lack of "basic skills" among Oregon high school students but that's not what the tests are measuring.

Again, according to this article, the test assesses whether they are on track to be college and career ready which is certainly not just "basic skills."

The summative tests determine whether students from the third grade to the 12th grade are proficient, or “on track to be college and career ready,” by their high school graduation.

 

"Or".  Not "And".

The first thing mentioned about this test, which is literally called the "Assessment of Essential Skills", talks about proficiency.  Then there's the "OR" part.  One would assume that some level of proficiency should be required to get a high school diploma and that level would be be needed before going on to college OR getting a job requiring reading and math skills.

Proficient = Competent

So, Andy is trying to convince us that Oregon's Assessment of Essential Skills is all about college and career. It is not. That is the "OR" part.

It is at its core (the basic purpose before the "OR" part) a high school graduation math and language competency test.

 

 

[concha]

6 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

These exercises are always comical when concha is involved.

He goes after Oregon because ostensibly they're a liberal state that he can rail against but the results show that scores have improved in two of the three measures since they paused testing. What's more is that in the liberal parts of the state, the scores improved across the board.

Testing doesn't cause proficiency. It's a ridiculous argument.

We won't hold out breath waiting for a concha screed against the grotesque education systems in places like Mississippi or Arkansas because they'll never come.

 

Andy is now flailing around making up some dumbass straw man about me claiming that standardized testing causes proficiency.

I said that nowhere.

I pointed out the FACT that Oregon is handing out diplomas to kids not deemed proficient ("competent") in essential math and language skills.