BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, FolsomPrisonBlues said: The right has convinced the uneducated that unions are bad. They are peddling this message to advocate for themselves so they can freely offer shitty wages, no job protection, and horrible benefits. When unions were at their peak, middle class America was at their peak. Employers were forced to do the right thing. Everyone made money on both sides. Arguing against ones own interests is truly baffling. Labor is a big overhead, suppress the shit out of it so the rich can get richer, then the dumbasses (right wingers) underneath fight for scraps. Medieval in every sense of the word. BGW 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 minute ago, Bormio said: Many employees vote against unions - see them as a rip-off Many? Really? What percentage? 10 dollars a month isnt worth wage and job protection. Benefit protection? Who would ensure these things are kept fair then? The employer? Lolllll You are drinking the fox news kool aid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 Just now, BUFORDGAWOLVES said: Labor is a big overhead, suppress the shit out of it so the rich can get richer, then the dumbasses (right wingers) underneath fight for scraps. Medieval in every sense of the word. BGW Exactly. Convince people unions are rip off. I cant believe people go for this shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 Just now, FolsomPrisonBlues said: Exactly. Convince people unions are rip off. I cant believe people go for this shit. Like in anything, you got bad unions and good unions... OSHA, etc provide a lot of protections... It will be interesting to see what the Teachers Union does.... thats a big one. BGW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 Just now, BUFORDGAWOLVES said: Like in anything, you got bad unions and good unions... OSHA, etc provide a lot of protections... It will be interesting to see what the Teachers Union does.... thats a big one. BGW OSHA is for safety protections on the jobs. Has nothing to do with what unions protect or provide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, FolsomPrisonBlues said: Many? Really? What percentage? 10 dollars a month isnt worth wage and job protection. Benefit protection? Who would ensure these things are kept fair then? The employer? Lolllll You are drinking the fox news kool aid Unions are often turned down in elections. Even when approved, many vote no. And $10 a month is laughable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 minute ago, Bormio said: Unions are often turned down in elections. Even when approved, many vote no. And $10 a month is laughable. So you haven't addressed my issue. If you don't like unions than fine. But who will ensure fair pay? Benefits? Retirement? These things are already getting killed. People got paid more doing the same jobs in the 1980s. those same jobs pay LESS now when you factor in inflation. This is ok!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 11 minutes ago, FolsomPrisonBlues said: So you haven't addressed my issue. If you don't like unions than fine. But who will ensure fair pay? Benefits? Retirement? These things are already getting killed. People got paid more doing the same jobs in the 1980s. those same jobs pay LESS now when you factor in inflation. This is ok!? Many think NAFTA, other trade agreements and foreign competition has killed private union jobs and wages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 16 minutes ago, FolsomPrisonBlues said: OSHA is for safety protections on the jobs. Has nothing to do with what unions protect or provide. Unions past tense used to provide this... BGW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 minute ago, Bormio said: Many think NAFTA, other trade agreements and foreign competition has killed private union jobs and wages. Indeed, cheaper labor overseas, product made cheaper with cheaper labor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 16 minutes ago, FolsomPrisonBlues said: So you haven't addressed my issue. If you don't like unions than fine. But who will ensure fair pay? Benefits? Retirement? These things are already getting killed. People got paid more doing the same jobs in the 1980s. those same jobs pay LESS now when you factor in inflation. This is ok!? Valid point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 16 minutes ago, BUFORDGAWOLVES said: Valid point. The height of union power was a time when the US had no real economic competitors in the world. I've read that the US controlled something like 70% of world industrial production at one point. Germany and Japan were smashed. Ditto France. Korea, China... undeveloped backwaters. By the 70s that began to change. VWs, Toyotas and Hondas started to show up. Our high cost, low-quality and unionized companies got their asses kicked. As wages grew in places like Germany and Japan, you saw them start to move production over here, overwhelmingly to non-union shops as it would have made no sense otherwise. People need to understand that the golden age when America and her unionized industrial giants ruled the world and printed money is long gone. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, concha said: The height of union power was a time when the US had no real economic competitors in the world. I've read that the US controlled something like 70% of world industrial production at one point. Germany and Japan were smashed. Ditto France. Korea, China... undeveloped backwaters. By the 70s that began to change. VWs, Toyotas and Hondas started to show up. Our high cost, low-quality and unionized companies got their asses kicked. As wages grew in places like Germany and Japan, you saw them start to move production over here, overwhelmingly to non-union shops as it would have made no sense otherwise. People need to understand that the golden age when America and her unionized industrial giants ruled the world and printed money is long gone. Yes sir, the industrial age is behind us.... So now we need to innovate, invent, superior tech etc because those days are over. Service sector can't sustain if people aren't making money and the slick shell games on Wall Street can only do so much for the rest of us working stiffs. Regards, BGW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSFBfan Posted June 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 hour ago, Bormio said: Unions would not have fought this so hard if only 1 or 2 people were going to leave. This is all about money. Teachers union about to lose millions and 300k members of course it's about money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBP66 Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 hour ago, Bormio said: Unions would not have fought this so hard if only 1 or 2 people were going to leave. This is all about money. no.....it's all about strength in numbers.....negotiating power... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBP66 Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 24 minutes ago, concha said: The height of union power was a time when the US had no real economic competitors in the world. I've read that the US controlled something like 70% of world industrial production at one point. Germany and Japan were smashed. Ditto France. Korea, China... undeveloped backwaters. By the 70s that began to change. VWs, Toyotas and Hondas started to show up. Our high cost, low-quality and unionized companies got their asses kicked. As wages grew in places like Germany and Japan, you saw them start to move production over here, overwhelmingly to non-union shops as it would have made no sense otherwise. People need to understand that the golden age when America and her unionized industrial giants ruled the world and printed money is long gone. much like the golden age of steel production??........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bormio Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, DBP66 said: no.....it's all about strength in numbers.....negotiating power... No, I am quite certain it is about money. Money buys power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBP66 Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 Just now, Bormio said: No, I am quite certain it is about money. Money buys power. no...it's all about membership and numbers.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan in daytona Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 2 hours ago, FolsomPrisonBlues said: The right has convinced the uneducated that unions are bad. They are peddling this message to advocate for themselves so they can freely offer shitty wages, no job protection, and horrible benefits. When unions were at their peak, middle class America was at their peak. Employers were forced to do the right thing. Everyone made money on both sides. Arguing against ones own interests is truly baffling. Agree 100%. By playing the HATE card on the insecurities of the ill-informed : gay rights, terrorist, immigrants, minorities, lazy takers, etc., the RIGHT has framed themselves as the party of the people. What a crock of $hit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSFBfan Posted June 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 All this ruling did was state that if you are not part of the union they cannot take dues from you. Political campaigns are gonna take a big hit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
concha Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 22 minutes ago, HSFBfan said: All this ruling did was state that if you are not part of the union they cannot take dues from you. Political campaigns are gonna take a big hit Guess which ones? Hence the hysteria on the left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSFBfan Posted June 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 minute ago, concha said: Guess which ones? Hence the hysteria on the left. Of course. Let's be honest Democrats just took a huge financial hit at a time where the DEmocrats are in debt and Republicans are taking in record numbers of money. As of right now people are leaving the unions and the ones not in the unions are asking for their money back I'm sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 hour ago, Bormio said: Many think NAFTA, other trade agreements and foreign competition has killed private union jobs and wages. Wages have been stagnant since the 80s. NAFTA came on way after that. That is a cop out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 1 hour ago, concha said: The height of union power was a time when the US had no real economic competitors in the world. I've read that the US controlled something like 70% of world industrial production at one point. Germany and Japan were smashed. Ditto France. Korea, China... undeveloped backwaters. By the 70s that began to change. VWs, Toyotas and Hondas started to show up. Our high cost, low-quality and unionized companies got their asses kicked. As wages grew in places like Germany and Japan, you saw them start to move production over here, overwhelmingly to non-union shops as it would have made no sense otherwise. People need to understand that the golden age when America and her unionized industrial giants ruled the world and printed money is long gone. Competition? For what? Cheap chinese goods that Wal-Mart sells. CA is the 5th largest economy in the world- as a state. There is ZERO reason why wages have not at least kept up with inflation, except for the excuse of unions as an excuse to drive down the cost of labor prices. Idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FolsomPrisonBlues Posted June 27, 2018 Report Share Posted June 27, 2018 44 minutes ago, dan in daytona said: Agree 100%. Be playing the HATE card on the insecurities of the ill-informed : gay rights, terrorist, immigrants, minorities, lazy takers, etc., the RIGHT has framed themselves as the party of the people. What a crock of $hit. Exactly. Total lies to get their base to think that good wages and good benefits are a bad thing, and the people protecting those things are bad. They literally vote against themselves. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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