Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 27 minutes ago, Pops said: This is what you said shortly after this..... 2 running clocks on top 100 opponents is your response to why STA is included in Tier 1 SMH Yes. Dominance against the best teams in the country is a pretty good indication of strength. Crazy, I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 23 minutes ago, Pops said: Bumping for response to STA how have they separated themselves from the Tier 2 teams? I told you and you just gave me a SMH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 16 minutes ago, Sammyswordsman said: STA based on their roster is always going to be borderline Tier 1. They did lose to Central, but slaughtered Dematha 38-0 and gave Deerfield beach their only loss 38-6. Dematha was extremely tough, they beat St. John's and Good Council and Gonzaga. I don't hold the hail mary in the finals against them. I'm treating the Central game as a "one off" similar to why I didn't drop MD out of Tier 1 after losing to SJB by 3 touchdowns. Appreciate explanation and don’t disagree as much as I don’t like still giving roster credit in week 13 DLS and CQ are undefeated with better SOS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Goldmember said: Yes. Dominance against the best teams in the country is a pretty good indication of strength. Crazy, I know. I’m not saying it’s not but geez, you understand the irony of mocking # of top 250 wins as silly criteria and coming back with # running clicks vs top 100 a couple of posts later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 6 minutes ago, Pops said: Appreciate explanation and don’t disagree as much as I don’t like still giving roster credit in week 13 DLS and CQ are undefeated with better SOS DLS struggeled with Folsom, and maybe should have lost. They only beat Buchanon by 7 and they beat The Bishop by 7 which was same as Tier 3 Centennial AZ who is also undefeated. Colquitt - could end up being Tier 1, but right now they don't have the marquee win. Same problem that St. Louis and SFA have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 11 minutes ago, CaliNorth said: Will STA play any ranked teams left in FLa playoffs ? I don't know. The Florida playoffs are not hand-picked so maybe, maybe not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 7 minutes ago, CaliNorth said: Wins and losses don't count there. Never said that. You're lying again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 2 minutes ago, Goldmember said: I told you and you just gave me a SMH. That was for the irony plus, I wanted to know sammy’s Logic i’ll Give you a bone — I’m not sure what you falsely said I was being dishonest about but one thing you could have more fairly accused is my description of MC as a “3-loss team”; it’s like people calling Trinity a 1st round loser or STA not a top 10 FL team in ‘11. MC a damned good team. STA May be one of best 5 teams in country — I just think that L ought to be a ding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 6 minutes ago, Pops said: I’m not saying it’s not but geez, you understand the irony of mocking # of top 250 wins as silly criteria and coming back with # running clicks vs top 100 a couple of posts later No, because record against top 250 is a meaningless and made-up statistic that you conjured up because you needed an argument against STA. A team can have a bunch of close wins over 200s and you would value that over two running clocks against top 100s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Pops said: That was for the irony There was no irony. It's more impressive to dominate a top 250 team (like Dwyer) than it is to scrape by two of them (like Buchanan and Bishop Gorman). Simply getting Ws isn't sufficient to be elite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Sammyswordsman said: DLS struggeled with Folsom, and maybe should have lost. They only beat Buchanon by 7 and they beat The Bishop by 7 which was same as Tier 3 Centennial AZ who is also undefeated. Colquitt - could end up being Tier 1, but right now they don't have the marquee win. Same problem that St. Louis and SFA have I get it — I do I’d probably bet on sta if they played today, but DLS beat a better team than anyone STA played and they’ve played more top teams and unlike sta they’re undefeated End if analysis that should matter more than who either of us think will win tomorrow imho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 3 minutes ago, Pops said: STA May be one of best 5 teams in country — I just think that L ought to be a ding It is. They might be #1 without it. I guess I should stop being amazed at your inability to learn anything. You pulled this same stunt, almost word-for-word, in 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Pops said: I get it — I do I’d probably bet on sta if they played today, but DLS beat a better team than anyone STA played and they’ve played more top teams and unlike sta they’re undefeated wnd if analysis that should matter more than who either of us think will win tomorrow imho The loss to Central was a ding, and put STA into Tier 2 for awhile. What helped STA was how well their opponents did. This was what DLS was lacking. Dematha played SJC within 6 points which was ranked in the Top 5 in some polls and also had marquee wins. STA crushed Dematha 38-0. Central also had a marquee win vs. Carol City. These 2nd degree games propelled STA up to Tier 1 If Folsom were to go on and beat Chandler or Allen or St. Eds, then DLS would have a strong case for Tier 1. So the SOS of the opponents benefitted STA over DLS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 13 minutes ago, Pops said: that should matter more than who either of us think will win tomorrow imho How the teams have played should matter more. I don't think De La Salle wins that, either. And apparently other people don't either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalven Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 27 minutes ago, Sammyswordsman said: The loss to Central was a ding, and put STA into Tier 2 for awhile. What helped STA was how well their opponents did. This was what DLS was lacking. Dematha beat SJC which was ranked in the Top 5 in some polls and also had marquee wins. STA crushed Dematha 38-0. Central also had a marquee win vs. Carol City. These 2nd degree games propelled STA up to Tier 1 If Folsom were to go on and beat Chandler or Allen or St. Eds, then DLS would have a strong case for Tier 1. So the SOS of the opponents benefitted STA over DLS I agree, STA is a clear tier above DLS. On paper and the eye test say so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 hour ago, CaliNorth said: This guy is trying to st up an alternate universe in his own mind. Wins and losses don't count there. Only running clocks and window dressing scores matter. It does sound a lot like Folsom, doesn't it ? While I agree with you, to be fair, I think he’s just saying that he ranks more on who he thinks would win (left unsaid, that will ALWAYS be STA), than on the resume-evaluation sort of approaches that algorithms allegedly do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Sammyswordsman said: The loss to Central was a ding, and put STA into Tier 2 for awhile. What helped STA was how well their opponents did. This was what DLS was lacking. Dematha beat SJC which was ranked in the Top 5 in some polls and also had marquee wins. STA crushed Dematha 38-0. Central also had a marquee win vs. Carol City. These 2nd degree games propelled STA up to Tier 1 If Folsom were to go on and beat Chandler or Allen or St. Eds, then DLS would have a strong case for Tier 1. So the SOS of the opponents benefitted STA over DLS That Might make some sense if dematha had really beaten sjc they didn’t but did play them as close as 5-6 Marietta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Kalven said: I agree, STA is a clear tier above DLS. On paper and the eye test say so. Just curious, does it change your mind knowing the explanation you agreed to was at least ill-based in facts? specifically “on paper” — I’ve yielded the eye test but don’t see on paper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliNorth Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, Pops said: While I agree with you, to be fair, I think he’s just saying that he ranks more on who he thinks would win (left unsaid, that will ALWAYS be STA), than on the resume-evaluation sort of approaches that algorithms allegedly do Which means he will only accept what he wants to believe and nothing else. You will never, ever, ever get him to concede anything, ever. He's completely God in his universe with no parameters, only using metrics for the moment, that he will try and use for his agenda. I don't think once I ever have heard him agree with anyone about anything, except for STA like you said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Goldmember said: How the teams have played should matter more. I don't think De La Salle wins that, either. And apparently other people don't either. I I appreciate your perspective — I think we have an honest disagreement I suspect we might agree that a blended approach is best just with different weighting if criteria not sure on what basis you’re throwing out the “and everyone agrees with me” claim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 Just now, CaliNorth said: Which means he will only accept what he wants to believe and nothing else. You will never, ever, ever get him to concede anything, ever. He's completely God in his universe with no parameters I have thought on many occasions that he reminds me of my wife Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliNorth Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 Just now, Pops said: I have thought on many occasions that he reminds me of my wife Now that is classic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 7 minutes ago, Pops said: That Might make some sense if dematha had really beaten sjc they didn’t but did play them as close as 5-6 Marietta Well you get my drift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 4 hours ago, Goldmember said: It is. They might be #1 without it. I guess I should stop being amazed at your inability to learn anything. You pulled this same stunt, almost word-for-word, in 2016. I’m actually being swayed a bit because you’ve caused me to compare sta ‘18 to DLS ‘15 and what my “objective” thoughts were at the time here’s my recall: — before beating CC (iow, around this time) that they were the best team in the country but understood the L had to count but I was ok with them being in top 5s — after they beat CC and got to #1 at cp, I said I wouldn’t vote them #1 because there were deserving undefeateds but supported CP’s placement (because I thought their resume warranted it even with the L) STA’s resume much like dls’15 to this point — DLS SOS a bit better but they did have one game (the week after trinity) that wasn’t a dominating performance, so maybe I ought to be more open-minded as it relates to sta v DLS in 2018, let me offer you this — I assume sta is going to win 7a and DLS is going to play in SBG Open. If DLS loses (as they surely will) I have no issue with sta over DLS in any and every poll or sammy’s Tiers and I’d hope that, even though you still might justifiably feel like sta would beat DLS, that DLS ought to deservedly be ranked higher if they win Agreed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 11 minutes ago, Sammyswordsman said: Well you get my drift. EYE-TEST DISCIPLE!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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