Sammyswordsman Posted November 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 5 minutes ago, Pops said: EYE-TEST DISCIPLE!!! Yep a big part. in 2015 I would have had DLS on Tier 1 and Trinity on Tier 2 or 3. If a team has multiple Top end games, I weight them all and don't use a loss as an automatic knock out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 8 minutes ago, Pops said: EYE-TEST DISCIPLE!!! The Tiers despises lack of data points which is why undefeated teams are held down until they get a relevant win. A team that has a marquee win and a marquee loss will rank higher than an undefeated team without a marquee contest. I am not referring to DLS because Folsom was a marquee win. If Folsom destroys their remaining opponents and DLS whips Liberty by 3 scores and can stay within 14 of MD, then I can see DLS getting to Tier 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 10 minutes ago, Sammyswordsman said: Yep a big part. in 2015 I would have had DLS on Tier 1 and Trinity on Tier 2 or 3. If a team has multiple Top end games, I weight them all and don't use a loss as an automatic knock out. Is that a characteristic of “tiers” would you employnsame approach to rankings for example, in this thread, I’ve described how DLS’15 @ #1 was justified at a rating service (resume evaluators). It not imho in the rankings (where you’d HAVE to put deserving undefeateds above them even if you would have bet on DLS in a game) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 3 minutes ago, Pops said: Is that a characteristic of “tiers” would you employnsame approach to rankings for example, in this thread, I’ve described how DLS’15 @ #1 was justified at a rating service (resume evaluators). It not imho in the rankings (where you’d HAVE to put deserving undefeateds above them even if you would have bet on DLS in a game) I think that is a fault of the rating services, being slaves to w/L records. DJ used to make me go nuts when he would put some undefeated team from Massachutsets or there abouts, ahead of a Trinity League team who lost a league game. That is why I started the Tiers. People seem to be buying into the Tiers as a better way to evaluate teams truthfully. Like you say, you may not argue with undefeated team "a" being ranked ahead of one loss team "b", but you may not be willing to put $$ on Team "a" were an actual game be played vs Team "b" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted November 26, 2018 Report Share Posted November 26, 2018 56 minutes ago, Sammyswordsman said: I think that is a fault of the rating services, being slaves to w/L records. DJ used to make me go nuts when he would put some undefeated team from Massachutsets or there abouts, ahead of a Trinity League team who lost a league game. That is why I started the Tiers. People seem to be buying into the Tiers as a better way to evaluate teams truthfully. Like you say, you may not argue with undefeated team "a" being ranked ahead of one loss team "b", but you may not be willing to put $$ on Team "a" were an actual game be played vs Team "b" I understand i think accomplishments need to mean something and whether the final score is 21-20 or 20-21 ought to matter more than a smidgen on a algorithm or eye test canes and you actually have common ground — no better teams are irrelevant sooner than the lower 2/3 of TL — their seasons will be made or broken by whether they get beat in first or 2nd rounds so why would you weight accomplishments more and are constantly defending teams that could win 25 states but have 6 losses — sta seemingly always needs a pass and a “trust me” on the eye test 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badrouter Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 23 hours ago, Sammyswordsman said: Columbia is on the correct Tier. I would also add Lee, Edgewater, and Hagarty to that Tier. Columbia split with Lee. Lee lost to Edgewater. Edgewater lost to Hagarty, and Hagerty lost to Lee. A vicious circle. Lakeland is border line Tier 4 but will stay in Tier 5 due to SOS until we see how then do next week. lol. A Hagerty team that finished 6-5 is a Tier 4 team? Ok, I get it, you're trolling. http://www.maxpreps.com/high-schools/hagerty-huskies-(oviedo,fl)/football/schedule.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 19 hours ago, Pops said: While I agree with you, to be fair, I think he’s just saying that he ranks more on who he thinks would win (left unsaid, that will ALWAYS be STA), than on the resume-evaluation sort of approaches that algorithms allegedly do No true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 19 hours ago, CaliNorth said: Which means he will only accept what he wants to believe and nothing else. You will never, ever, ever get him to concede anything, ever. He's completely God in his universe with no parameters, only using metrics for the moment, that he will try and use for his agenda. I don't think once I ever have heard him agree with anyone about anything, except for STA like you said Is this Pops you're taking about? Because it's certainly not me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 19 hours ago, Pops said: not sure on what basis you’re throwing out the “and everyone agrees with me” claim I never said that everyone agrees with me. Nice try, Pops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 19 hours ago, Pops said: I have thought on many occasions that he reminds me of my wife You once claimed that you would bet your mortgage on Jesuit +28 against De La Salle. Jesuit lost 63-0. So if I was anything like your wife, we'd be in divorce proceedings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliNorth Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Goldmember said: Is this Pops you're taking about? Because it's certainly not me. Actually, aside from being extremely difficult to dialog with, I think you do have a good eye for football and probably would do pretty good if you were a betting man making picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 3 hours ago, badrouter said: lol. A Hagerty team that finished 6-5 is a Tier 4 team? Ok, I get it, you're trolling. http://www.maxpreps.com/high-schools/hagerty-huskies-(oviedo,fl)/football/schedule.htm They are not listed in Tier 4. It was just a hypothetical extrapolation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StingMan44 Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 On 11/25/2018 at 7:41 PM, Sammyswordsman said: Chandler AZ moved from Tier 4 to Tier 3 despite being idle. This was a correction from the previous week Tier. Chandler has been red hot since losing by only 14 on the road to Cen10. Chandler can end up in Tier 2 with a win next week and in the Geico, if they get there. BTW, Chandler lost by 22 against Cen10 (Ca) and has had 3 victories by 14 points or less since. Centennial’s only game within 23 pts was when they beat Bishop Gorman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 8 minutes ago, StingMan44 said: BTW, Chandler lost by 22 against Cen10 (Ca) and has had 3 victories by 14 points or less since. Centennial’s only game within 23 pts was when they beat Bishop Gorman. Thanks for the updates. I have moved Centennial to the same Tier (3) as Chandler. We will see how both perform in the coming weeks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 27, 2018 Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 1 hour ago, StingMan44 said: Centennial’s only game within 23 pts was when they beat Bishop Gorman. The remainder of opponents were Pop Warner teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2018 7 minutes ago, Goldmember said: The remainder of opponents were Pop Warner teams. For once you are the more diplomatic member. I called the remainder of opponents...turds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
954gator Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 On 11/26/2018 at 1:27 AM, Pops said: If DLS loses (as they surely will) Is this your true thought on the game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StingMan44 Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Sammyswordsman said: For once you are the more diplomatic member. I called the remainder of opponents...turds. Same number of games against Top 1650 opponents as Duncanville (7)......and SFA hasnt played a top 2100 team this year but is somehow Tier 2. So SFA’s spot is 100% based on who is on their roster and not how good the team has proven to be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 1 hour ago, StingMan44 said: Same number of games against Top 1650 opponents as Duncanville (7)......and SFA hasnt played a top 2100 team this year but is somehow Tier 2. So SFA’s spot is 100% based on who is on their roster and not how good the team has proven to be. Top 1650 opponents. Good one, guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StingMan44 Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, Goldmember said: Top 1650 opponents. Good one, guy. Oh, I’m sorry (sarcasm)! Is there a well known cutoff of solid teams? 1000? But 1001 sucks? Since there are about 15,000 high schools with 11 man football in the US, #1650 would be 89th percentile. To me, if you are 89th percentile, you must be at least a solid team. Tell me what the proper cutoff is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, StingMan44 said: To me, if you are 89th percentile, you must be at least a solid team. You'd be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StingMan44 Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, Goldmember said: You'd be wrong. Cool story, bro! Thanks for your well-supported answer to my question, but I guess that’s why your “reputation” is what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 28, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 12 minutes ago, StingMan44 said: Oh, I’m sorry (sarcasm)! Is there a well known cutoff of solid teams? 1000? But 1001 sucks? Since there are about 15,000 high schools with 11 man football in the US, #1650 would be 89th percentile. To me, if you are 89th percentile, you must be at least a solid team. Tell me what the proper cutoff is? The cutoff is playing teams more than 3 Tiers below your team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StingMan44 Posted November 28, 2018 Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 15 minutes ago, Sammyswordsman said: The cutoff is playing teams more than 3 Tiers below your team LMAO....so Allen, Duncanville, STA, St Louis, John Curtis, Warren Central, Christian Brothers, West Monroe, ULAB and Massillon have combined for ZERO quality wins by your Tier rankings/quality opponent qualifications??? Way to make yourself look dumb!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammyswordsman Posted November 28, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2018 11 minutes ago, StingMan44 said: LMAO....so Allen, Duncanville, STA, St Louis, John Curtis, Warren Central, Christian Brothers, West Monroe, ULAB and Massillon have combined for ZERO quality wins by your Tier rankings/quality opponent qualifications??? Way to make yourself look dumb!!!! Not all teams are listed on the Tiers. (Please refer to the methodolgy) Only the ones we talk about. Many of the opponents of these teams would be listed in the Top 6 Tiers if anyone asked for a certain team to be added. Last week I placed a couple of Nor Cal teams because a poster inquired about them and where the teams would be placed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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