VegasKama'aina Posted December 4, 2019 Report Share Posted December 4, 2019 5 hours ago, The Guru said: But Punahou is ranked #21 by calpreps. That's hardly underrated. Do you think Hawaii has 4 teams in the top 80 like calpreps has it? St. Louis #4, Punahou #21, Kuhuku #42, and Mililani #80. I think that's over the top. It speaks to the scaling and clustering issues that it has. Massey is more aligned with my thoughts. They have St. Louis #5, Punahou #62, Kuhuku #138, and Mililani #192. Personally I would put Punahou somewhere between CalPreps and Massey in the #40-#50 range but it's so subjective that it really is difficult to say for sure. Mililani had the win against Liberty (NV) and played a deceptively competitive game against SJB so I might rank them in the low #100 range. As for Kahuku, it's tough to really rank them because they are so one-dimensional. Sure, they do that one thing very well, but I assume that most top #100 teams wouldn't have too much of a problem playing against them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasKama'aina Posted December 4, 2019 Report Share Posted December 4, 2019 2 hours ago, legendsofthefall said: My good college buddy went to and played for St. Louis in the mid 90's. I moved out there from NJ for work about 15 years ago for a brief stint and got to know more about the program. Those were some powerhouse teams they had back in the 90's with nasty O Lines including standout college and pros in Dominic Raiola and Olin Kreutz. Those teams were LOADED with talent. Darnell Arceneaux went on to play at Utah and was a really solid dual-threat D1 guy. Chris Fuamatu-Ma'afala, who also played at Utah and eventually with the Steelers, was an absolute monster. Probably my favorite high school player I've ever watched was George Ornellas who was undersized but surprisingly tough for his diminutive stature and had some insane quickness and change of direction. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legendsofthefall Posted December 4, 2019 Report Share Posted December 4, 2019 40 minutes ago, VegasKama'aina said: Those teams were LOADED with talent. Darnell Arceneaux went on to play at Utah and was a really solid dual-threat D1 guy. Chris Fuamatu-Ma'afala, who also played at Utah and eventually with the Steelers, was an absolute monster. Probably my favorite high school player I've ever watched was George Ornellas who was undersized but surprisingly tough for his diminutive stature and had some insane quickness and change of direction. Yup. Fu was a beast. Damn I forgot about him. Haven't heard that name in years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiiboy396 Posted December 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 21 hours ago, The Guru said: But Punahou is ranked #21 by calpreps. That's hardly underrated. Do you think Hawaii has 4 teams in the top 80 like calpreps has it? St. Louis #4, Punahou #21, Kuhuku #42, and Mililani #80. I think that's over the top. It speaks to the scaling and clustering issues that it has. Massey is more aligned with my thoughts. They have St. Louis #5, Punahou #62, Kuhuku #138, and Mililani #192. I really think that Punahou is a top 25 team. Kahuku and Miliani are maybe in the 200-250 range. Kahuku is 1 dimensional but their defense is solid. Miliani looked a lot better in the first half of the year. They had a solid defense but their QB play was down. Considering who Agbyani at Miliani was following Milton and Gabriel both at UCF now. Hard to live up to that. Everyone is going to wonder how good Punahou could of been if their starting QB was healthy. Believe he had season ending injury in week 2 or 3. They had a true freshman at QB this year after that. He will be a Pac 12 recruit when his time comes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiiboy396 Posted December 5, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 15 hours ago, legendsofthefall said: Yup. Fu was a beast. Damn I forgot about him. Haven't heard that name in years. I wish I could weigh in on this but I'm to young to really know that far back in Stl history. But this is def their best team in the last 20 years. Its def there most complete team and deepest team. Stl scores this year are pretty decieving as well.many of their games they won by 35 or so points. If there coaches wanted to they could have easily won by 50+ in many of their games by their starters to play in the 3rd qtr. Most games starters where out at the beginning of the 2nd half and even before halftime. Lots of people lost money on them every week becua of that lol jk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guru Posted December 5, 2019 Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 1 hour ago, hawaiiboy396 said: I really think that Punahou is a top 25 team. There's almost no chance that this is true. Beat Kahuku, 21-13 Beat Mililani, 3-0 Beat Campbell, 31-21 Beat Kamehameha, 15-5 It strains credulity to think that 5 teams on the island of Oahu (including St. Louis) could play 6 total games within 10 points of a top 25 national team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guru Posted December 5, 2019 Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 1 hour ago, hawaiiboy396 said: Stl scores this year are pretty decieving as well.many of their games they won by 35 or so points. If there coaches wanted to they could have easily won by 50+ in many of their games by their starters to play in the 3rd qtr. Most games starters where out at the beginning of the 2nd half and even before halftime. I guarantee you that people don't think St. Louis is overrated because they only won some games by 35 instead of 50. People think they're overrated because they only beat Punahou by 6 points and 7 points in their two meetings, and they only beat Bishop Gorman by 12. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
golfaddict1 Posted December 5, 2019 Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 On 12/4/2019 at 9:23 AM, The Guru said: But Punahou is ranked #21 by calpreps. That's hardly underrated. Do you think Hawaii has 4 teams in the top 80 like calpreps has it? St. Louis #4, Punahou #21, Kuhuku #42, and Mililani #80. I think that's over the top. It speaks to the scaling and clustering issues that it has. Massey is more aligned with my thoughts. They have St. Louis #5, Punahou #62, Kuhuku #138, and Mililani #192. ... and it's more a Captain Kirk decision than a Spock one. I've used HI example often in recent years, with CP favoring HI more than Massey in terms of an overall scale strength position. Massey has some cool novelty tools... one of which is seeing the week's movement from state to national. Using HI as an example, here you can see the current rating and the weekly movement from a state an national scaled level. I have captured the Chutes and Ladders below. The clear scaled champion in this exercise is Hilo. Freeman opted for Hi Hilo is the clear scaled MVP... it gained 6 spots in-state from 11 to 5th. Now have a look at the next screen, which is the national gainers. Here is where the fun comes in... this is a list of the biggest gainers from last week's games on a national scaled basis. HIlo raced up the ladder from 1668 to 464, increasing 1204 spots. Cue the Jeffersons theme song Fyi, the largest sliders below on Massey's national scale. If anyone wants to know what any symbols mean, let me know but forget HFA (home field advantage as Massey doesn't adjust this in his HS ratings and uses a static 1.5 number). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AztecPadre Posted December 5, 2019 Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 22 hours ago, VegasKama'aina said: Those teams were LOADED with talent. Darnell Arceneaux went on to play at Utah and was a really solid dual-threat D1 guy. Chris Fuamatu-Ma'afala, who also played at Utah and eventually with the Steelers, was an absolute monster. Probably my favorite high school player I've ever watched was George Ornellas who was undersized but surprisingly tough for his diminutive stature and had some insane quickness and change of direction. One of my all time favorite college players. He was a beast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigrobstercraws Posted December 5, 2019 Report Share Posted December 5, 2019 On 12/3/2019 at 11:43 PM, VegasKama'aina said: Much has been made on the islands about this possibly being the best St Louis team ever but I'm not sure that I agree. Recruiting the islands has become a bit more accessible as the reputation of high school football in Hawai'i has grown nationwide and I think that the current team has benefitted from that increased visibility. But, as hawaiiboy396 pointed out, the current team lacks a consistent running attack and to me that is a big thing that keeps me from being able to compare this team favorably with some of the Crusader teams of the 1990's. That said, it'll still be an interesting test to see how they can handle a team like STA. I'm guessing the high-end talent on each team will be similar, but the big thing I would like to see is how St Louis' depth of talent compares with a true blue-chip program. Either way it's a good opportunity to build the reputation of Hawai'i football on a national scale. In the 1990s. they didn't play the level of teams STA is at. They played those at the level of CIF D1 first round loser Capo Valley in 1993 or lower like Canyon Country who bounced them by 6 TDs. Plus, football on Oahu still had public school kids attending the school they lived near. So talent was more spread out instead of concentrated in 2-3 teams on Oahu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalven Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 I think HI top 5 would be a top 5 state behind the usual top 3 and Ga. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 11 hours ago, Kalven said: I think HI top 5 would be a top 5 state behind the usual top 3 and Ga. St. Louis is top 10, Punahou is 50-100, and Kahuku and Mililani are 100-200. I wouldn’t put the state’s top 5 at 4th or 5th best state in the entire country. Don’t get wrong, they are formidable, but, realistically, are probably in the 15-25 range for state rankings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalven Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 21 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: St. Louis is top 10, Punahou is 50-100, and Kahuku and Mililani are 100-200. I wouldn’t put the state’s top 5 at 4th or 5th best state in the entire country. Don’t get wrong, they are formidable, but, realistically, are probably in the 15-25 range for state rankings. If we are talking just Top 5, no way they are 15-25 STATE RANKING! STL Punahou Kahuku Miliani Hilo vs Ohio? Mentor Elder St Ed Pickerington Wsahington or Lousiana? Arch CBR Acadiana Curtis STM Just top 5 teams state ranking: 2019 1. Cali 2. Texas 3. Georgia 4. Florida 5. Maryland 6. Hawaii 7. Jersey 8. Ohio 9. Louie 10. Zona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 2 hours ago, Kalven said: If we are talking just Top 5, no way they are 15-25 STATE RANKING! STL Punahou Kahuku Miliani Hilo Just top 5 teams state ranking: 2019 1. Cali 2. Texas 3. Georgia 4. Florida 5. Maryland 6. Hawaii 7. Jersey 8. Ohio 9. Louie 10. Zona We'll use your top 5 teams for HI and agree on your top 5 states. Here's what would happen against 10 or so other state's top 5: Ohio 1. St. Louis over Pick Central 2.Mentor over Punahou 3. St. Ed over Kahuku 4. Elder over Mililani 5. LaSalle over Hilo 4-1 Ohio Pennsylvania 1. StL over SJP 2. Punahou over Pitt CC 3. Kahuku over C. Dauphin 4. Pine-Richland over Mililani 5. Manheim T'ship over Hilo 3-2 Pennsylvania Louisiana 1. StL over BR Catholic 2. Rummel over Punahou 3. Curtis over Kahuku 4. Acadiana over Mililani 5. STM over Hilo 4-1 Louisiana New Jersey 1. StL over SPP 2. DBP over Punahou 3. SJR over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Peddie 5. DePaul over Hilo 4-1 New Jersey Illinois 1. StL over LWE 2. ESL over Punahou 3. Mt. Carmel over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Gurnee T'ship 5. H-F over Hilo 4-1 Illinois Kentucky 1. StL over Male 2. Punahou over Cov. Cath. 3. Trinity over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Douglass Co. 5. Boyle Co. over Hilo 3-2 Kentucky Tennessee 1. StL over Maryville 2. Punahou over Ravenwood 3. Kahuku over Alcoa 4. Oakland over Mililani 5. McCallie over Hilo 3-2 Hawa'ii Indiana 1. StL over New Palestine 2. Indy Cath over Punahou 3. Carmel over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Chatard 5. Ctr Grove over Hilo 3-2 Indiana Alabama 1. StL over Thompson 2. Punahou over Hoover 3. Phx City Cent. over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Opelika 5. Pinson Valley over Hilo 3-2 Hawa'ii North Carolina 1. StL over Richmond 2. Punahou over Myers Park 3. Vance over Kahuku 4. Mallard Crk over Mililani 5. Leesville Rd over Hilo 3-2 N. Carolina South Carolina 1. StL over D. Fork 2. Dorman over Punahou 3. Gaffney over Kahuku 4. Byrnes over Mililani 5. Clover over Hilo 4-1 S. Carolina Arizona 1. StL over Chandler 2. Punahou over Saguaro 3. Kahuku over Hamilton 4. Salpointe over Mililani 5. Peoria Cen10 over Hilo 3-2 Hawa'ii Utah 1. StL over Corner Cany. 2. Punahou over Amer. Fork 3. Lone Peak over Kahuku 4. SLC East over Mililani 5. Herriman over Hilo 3-2 Utah Out of those 13 other states I only see Hawa'ii winning a top 5 battle against 3 of them. That would put them, at least, 15th this year. Personally, I think Campbell would wipe the floor with Hilo and should be your #5 team. Either way, though, Campbell wouldn't have won any of those 5 vs 5 matchups. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Guru Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 39 minutes ago, Omaha Vol said: 4. Oakland over Mililani Man, you just can't quit Oakland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalven Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 1 hour ago, Omaha Vol said: We'll use your top 5 teams for HI and agree on your top 5 states. Here's what would happen against 10 or so other state's top 5: Ohio 1. St. Louis over Pick Central 2.Mentor over Punahou 3. St. Ed over Kahuku 4. Elder over Mililani 5. LaSalle over Hilo 4-1 Ohio Pennsylvania 1. StL over SJP 2. Punahou over Pitt CC 3. Kahuku over C. Dauphin 4. Pine-Richland over Mililani 5. Manheim T'ship over Hilo 3-2 Pennsylvania Louisiana 1. StL over BR Catholic 2. Rummel over Punahou 3. Curtis over Kahuku 4. Acadiana over Mililani 5. STM over Hilo 4-1 Louisiana New Jersey 1. StL over SPP 2. DBP over Punahou 3. SJR over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Peddie 5. DePaul over Hilo 4-1 New Jersey Illinois 1. StL over LWE 2. ESL over Punahou 3. Mt. Carmel over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Gurnee T'ship 5. H-F over Hilo 4-1 Illinois Kentucky 1. StL over Male 2. Punahou over Cov. Cath. 3. Trinity over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Douglass Co. 5. Boyle Co. over Hilo 3-2 Kentucky Tennessee 1. StL over Maryville 2. Punahou over Ravenwood 3. Kahuku over Alcoa 4. Oakland over Mililani 5. McCallie over Hilo 3-2 Hawa'ii Indiana 1. StL over New Palestine 2. Indy Cath over Punahou 3. Carmel over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Chatard 5. Ctr Grove over Hilo 3-2 Indiana Alabama 1. StL over Thompson 2. Punahou over Hoover 3. Phx City Cent. over Kahuku 4. Mililani over Opelika 5. Pinson Valley over Hilo 3-2 Hawa'ii North Carolina 1. StL over Richmond 2. Punahou over Myers Park 3. Vance over Kahuku 4. Mallard Crk over Mililani 5. Leesville Rd over Hilo 3-2 N. Carolina South Carolina 1. StL over D. Fork 2. Dorman over Punahou 3. Gaffney over Kahuku 4. Byrnes over Mililani 5. Clover over Hilo 4-1 S. Carolina Arizona 1. StL over Chandler 2. Punahou over Saguaro 3. Kahuku over Hamilton 4. Salpointe over Mililani 5. Peoria Cen10 over Hilo 3-2 Hawa'ii Utah 1. StL over Corner Cany. 2. Punahou over Amer. Fork 3. Lone Peak over Kahuku 4. SLC East over Mililani 5. Herriman over Hilo 3-2 Utah Out of those 13 other states I only see Hawa'ii winning a top 5 battle against 3 of them. That would put them, at least, 15th this year. Personally, I think Campbell would wipe the floor with Hilo and should be your #5 team. Either way, though, Campbell wouldn't have won any of those 5 vs 5 matchups. I’m just going to start here, Mentor over Puna? Lmao why so confident? Dematha wiped the floor with St I who lost by 7 only to Mentor. Puna and Mililani are pretty equal. And Mililiani is just as good or just slightly less better than Dematha (SJB game) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omaha Vol Posted December 6, 2019 Report Share Posted December 6, 2019 St. Louis crushed both Kahuku and Mililani. Punahou was the only team to hang with the Crusaders. Kahuku and Mililani were clearly a step below those other two....this year. And yes, Mentor would beat Punahou this year. St. Iggy getting crushed by DeMatha was an aberration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_e Posted December 7, 2019 Report Share Posted December 7, 2019 2 hours ago, Kalven said: I’m just going to start here, Mentor over Puna? Lmao why so confident? Dematha wiped the floor with St I who lost by 7 only to Mentor. Puna and Mililani are pretty equal. And Mililiani is just as good or just slightly less better than Dematha (SJB game) Did you even watched the Mililani vs SJB game. That was a no contest. SJB could have called the score. DeMatha defense is tough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigrobstercraws Posted December 7, 2019 Report Share Posted December 7, 2019 At least the Trojans waxed LBP lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawaiiboy396 Posted December 7, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2019 Update All American LB Jordan Botelho will not play in Geico or All American Bowl in mainland do to legal problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FootballGuy Posted December 7, 2019 Report Share Posted December 7, 2019 5 hours ago, hawaiiboy396 said: Update All American LB Jordan Botelho will not play in Geico or All American Bowl in mainland do to legal problems. Because of that fight, huh? Smh.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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