golfaddict1 Posted May 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 52 minutes ago, steeler01 said: Most important games instate, not when measuring teams nationally. You don't need to add bonus points to teams to find out whose who instate. That's why you get 3A teams in Texas finishing in the top 10 in the state in calpreps. No interplay between 6A and 3A and bonus points during the playoffs. Wooderson brought this up regarding AZ with regards to class strength. Valid point. Those 3A's are passing 847 Camden County too no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 4 hours ago, golfaddict1 said: Wooderson brought this up regarding AZ with regards to class strength. Valid point. Those 3A's are passing 847 Camden County too no? Yes they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCBlackhatter Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 11 hours ago, Pops said: Is AHP in the GA playoffs? You just compared the 5th best team in one of CA's 10 sections to a top FL team plus 5 of best teams in GA so I'll give you this one, although CVC and Lowndes would be close to a coin toss not sure if you'd feel same way about deductions had DLS been in GA last 25 years with 18-20 championships in a drawer in the coachs' office (they all share one) You misunderstood apparently, and I'm not the least bit surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 48 minutes ago, CCBlackhatter said: You misunderstood apparently, and I'm not the least bit surprised. I think a lot of people are misunderstood by you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GloryDays Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 12 hours ago, CCBlackhatter said: We damn sure know that a game versus Clayton Valley Charter is nowhere near 210% more important, challenging, etc. than a regular season opponent like AHP, Roswell, Mill Creek, Valdosta, Lowndes, or Tucker. Ned should deduct 10 points from every team in Norcal until one of them can play with and/or beat DLS. At most, Ned should do this boost for a State Championship game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GloryDays Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 12 hours ago, golfaddict1 said: Or maybe less resumes would be better if the playoff boost wasn't in play? I like that we are in the nuts and bolts portion and welcome your thoughts. Im not ready to choose no boost, 210 pct or a tiered boost as a best scenario without hearing from others and gathering info and testing it . Seems to me if the ratings are adjusting weekly that playoff boost is infiltrating the regular season ratings as well no? That may be a bit too much... A plus b divided by 2 is your avg. but A has B playoff boost factored in. I've had some drinks tonight but does this make any sense? An across the board boost for all playoff games is kinda overkill. I like the idea of a tiered boost based on round (ie round 1 +0, championship +100%). Now, how to factor in all the different classes? And the regions were early playoff games are inherently harder than others? Lotta moving parts Golf. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCBlackhatter Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 13 minutes ago, Pops said: I think a lot of people are misunderstood by you Im sorry. Maybe if you read the post you will understand. Tell us again why CVC should be waited 210% more than a much more challenging regular season in Roswell and the others mentioned. Or lets make it easy for you. Should the game against CVC be weighted 210% more than East? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 12 minutes ago, CCBlackhatter said: Im sorry. Maybe if you read the post you will understand. Tell us again why CVC should be waited 210% more than a much more challenging regular season in Roswell and the others mentioned. Or lets make it easy for you. Should the game against CVC be weighted 210% more than East? As tonoart 1, it's you who misunderstands -- unless I'm mistaken, Roswell got the playoff boost for 5 games while CVC only got it for 1-game because they opened with DLS as to oart 2, don't know about 210%, but yes the CVC game is a playoff -- east was a pre-league. Good example because we all go Gaga for OOS games which are especially appealing to the 0.00000001% of Americans who are national hsfb junkies, but teams ought to try to be peaking at playoffs when it's most important to play your best -- am not certain but believe CVC dropped after that 28-0 loss (they were ahead of Lowndes) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCBlackhatter Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 2 minutes ago, Pops said: As tonoart 1, it's you who misunderstands -- unless I'm mistaken, Roswell got the playoff boost for 5 games while CVC only got it for 1-game because they opened with DLS as to oart 2, don't know about 210%, but yes the CVC game is a playoff -- east was a pre-league. Good example because we all go Gaga for OOS games which are especially appealing to the 0.00000001% of Americans who are national hsfb junkies, but teams ought to try to be peaking at playoffs when it's most important to play your best -- am not certain but believe CVC dropped after that 28-0 loss (they were ahead of Lowndes) Ok, apparently that wasn't easy for you considering the tangent you just veered off on. A playoff game, especially one against an outclassed opponent, should not be weighted 10% more nor 210% more than any other game for the sole fact that it is a playoff game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pops Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 29 minutes ago, CCBlackhatter said: Ok, apparently that wasn't easy for you considering the tangent you just veered off on. A playoff game, especially one against an outclassed opponent, should not be weighted 10% more nor 210% more than any other game for the sole fact that it is a playoff game. Thanks for your opinion maybe it's different in south GA, but out west post season is more important than preseason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coletrain06 Posted May 20, 2017 Report Share Posted May 20, 2017 15 hours ago, golfaddict1 said: Or maybe less resumes would be better if the playoff boost wasn't in play? I like that we are in the nuts and bolts portion and welcome your thoughts. Im not ready to choose no boost, 210 pct or a tiered boost as a best scenario without hearing from others and gathering info and testing it . Seems to me if the ratings are adjusting weekly that playoff boost is infiltrating the regular season ratings as well no? That may be a bit too much... A plus b divided by 2 is your avg. but A has B playoff boost factored in. I've had some drinks tonight but does this make any sense? It always makes sense to have some drinks! haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 The 2.1x factor for the playoffs is correct. I'm surprised that more people didn't already know this. (Oh, and that's not a 210% boost, statistically. Stop saying that. It's silly.) Whether or not anyone takes the time to actually think about it, most human polls generally do the same. If a team goes 7-3 in the regular season, but makes a deep run in the playoffs, do they not typically go ahead of a 10-0 team that loses in the first round? I don't understand what is so shocking about this. You may disagree that "2.1" should be used, but I don't get the confusion of relying more on the most recent games (i.e., playoffs). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYHSFAN33 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 20 minutes ago, Cal 14 said: The 2.1x factor for the playoffs is correct. I'm surprised that more people didn't already know this. (Oh, and that's not a 210% boost, statistically. Stop saying that. It's silly.) Whether or not anyone takes the time to actually think about it, most human polls generally do the same. If a team goes 7-3 in the regular season, but makes a deep run in the playoffs, do they not typically go ahead of a 10-0 team that loses in the first round? I don't understand what is so shocking about this. You may disagree that "2.1" should be used, but I don't get the confusion of relying more on the most recent games (i.e., playoffs). There is no confusion. What Golf and CC are saying is that a 1st round playoff game vs sisters of the poor should not be weighted more heavily than a regular season game vs a stronger opponent. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 1 minute ago, NYHSFAN33 said: There is no confusion. What Golf and CC are saying is that a 1st round playoff game vs sisters of the poor should not be weighted more heavily than a regular season game vs a stronger opponent. They typically are. If Team A is rated 60 and beats Team B who is rated at 55 in the regular season, that is worth more than beating someone rated 20 in the playoffs. Furthermore, if Team B also makes a run in the playoffs, that provides further boost for Team A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, Cal 14 said: They typically are. By whom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 Also, look at it this way, let's say Team A beats Team B in the regular season. But, in the playoffs, Team B gets revenge. Which team is typically ranked higher at the end? It's the team that wins in the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 2 minutes ago, steeler01 said: By whom? See edited post above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 4 minutes ago, Cal 14 said: Also, look at it this way, let's say Team A beats Team B in the regular season. But, in the playoffs, Team B gets revenge. Which team is typically ranked higher at the end? It's the team that wins in the playoffs. This is very different from what is being argued. Bosco beating a team like Milliken in the playoffs should not give them a 2.1 boost just because it's a playoff game. Your scenario is vey different from what's being discussed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 12 minutes ago, steeler01 said: This is very different from what is being argued. Bosco beating a team like Milliken in the playoffs should not give them a 2.1 boost just because it's a playoff game. Your scenario is vey different from what's being discussed No, it isn't. Bosco beating Milliken doesn't make that this game is now rated as if Milliken is Mater Dei. In fact, what you described is just about the exact scenario I demonstrated. Furthermore, spread out over the course of 11-16 games, there is only one scenario in which a single game could have any massive impact: that is if the winning team is undefeated and the losing team only has one loss. In this case, the winning team must remain higher in calpreps, regardless of how much they may struggle the rest of the year (provided they remain undefeated). They will always remain about 0.2 pts ahead and simply ride the coattails of that one big win. Otherwise, even if there is a 10-point rating gap between opponents, over the course of the year, that is generally less than a 1-point impact on the final rating of a team. Think about that. If you get a win over a 60-rated team in the regular season and a 35-rated team in the playoffs, your overall rating impact from the playoff win might only be 1 point. Is that really what is causing all of the panic? It actually takes a drastic win (i.e., DLS beating a CC in a state bowl game) to actually do anything significant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 On top of that, when there is a huge gap in the ratings, those games tend to count less in general. Note the "Trends" pages for teams ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 16 minutes ago, Cal 14 said: No, it isn't. Bosco beating Milliken doesn't make that this game is now rated as if Milliken is Mater Dei. In fact, what you described is just about the exact scenario You described a scenario regarding two teams that are equal, with one winning in the playoffs and the other during the regular season. We're talking about beating vastly inferior teams, and getting a bump for it just because it's a playoff game. There should be no bump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 Just now, Cal 14 said: On top of that, when there is a huge gap in the ratings, those games tend to count less in general. Note the "Trends" pages for teams ratings. I've never taken the time to dissect calpreps, but I feel there should be no playoff boosts 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 11 minutes ago, steeler01 said: I've never taken the time to dissect calpreps, but I feel there should be no playoff boosts There always is, regardless of what ranking/rating system you use. Always. What people here aren't getting is that most of that boost doesn't really impact anything unless it's against a good team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal 14 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 10 minutes ago, steeler01 said: You described a scenario regarding two teams that are equal, with one winning in the playoffs and the other during the playoffs. We're talking about beating vastly inferior teams, and getting a bump for it just because it's a playoff game. There should be no bump. Look at this page for Mater Dei last year. Ned specifically states that their first two playoff games were attributed at a lower significance towards the Monarchs' final rating. They didn't play a meaningful playoff game until Rancho Cucamonga and calpreps took that into account. http://calpreps.com/cgi-bin/2016/trend.pl?school=Mater_Dei_(Santa_Ana,_CA) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted May 30, 2017 Report Share Posted May 30, 2017 9 minutes ago, Cal 14 said: There always is, regardless of what ranking/rating system you use. Always. What people here aren't getting is that most of that boost doesn't really impact anything unless it's against a good team. Nobody ever gives anyone a boost to a team like Bosco for beating Milliken in the playoffs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.