Biden admits there is no federal solution to the pandemic

[Atticus Finch]

2 minutes ago, badrouter said:

I haven't paid close attention to anything Warrior is arguing.

Which is obvious given how badly you've done trying to vouch for him.

[Atticus Finch]

2 minutes ago, badrouter said:

I speak for myself.

Which is also obvious given how readily you avoid the facts to prop up your own thoughts. 

[181pl]

30 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

When I personally know 12 people who are triple vaccinated and got Covid (albeit mild except one elderly family member in the hospital) its not anecdotal. If u left your abode and observed with your own eyes you may figure things out Einstein…

[badrouter]

8 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

You display the same tick as concha: rabidly defending someone who stopped their line of questioning because they were so thoroughly exposed and embarrassed.

You will continue to ignore the charts that show real-world effectiveness because you are committed to your false narratives.

I can't recall ever consciously thinking, "Man, I've got to defend warrior". lol

I've never ignored or denied real-world effectiveness of the vaccines. 

[Atticus Finch]

8 minutes ago, badrouter said:

My agenda is finding and stating the truth.

This is rich.

"That data is from clinical trials and can't be trusted!

(Presented with real-world effectiveness data)

"Uhh, we need to wait for more data!"

(Told that there are 200 million data points in the real world)

"Uhh, what's that!

(Points away and runs)

[Atticus Finch]

5 minutes ago, badrouter said:

And you struggle with that because I'm not arguing the kinds of points you're used to pushing back against.

I hate to inform you but I'm not struggling at all with your points.

[181pl]

22 minutes ago, golfaddict1 said:

How many have minor symptoms compared to those who haven’t? 

My wife had Covid recently and she had no fever and just felt weak for a handful of days.  My guess she got it from our daughter, who flew from Europe on a Petri dish vessel.  She also didn’t experience any complications.  

A good friend of mine in IL had Covid last week and was minutes from driving to ER due to “barbed wire” throat as he referred to it with major swelling pain. He was not triple vaxxed.  He’s still hurting today while on meds to ease the pain.  

 

never had a fever even w covid before vaccines. for me the bad symptoms were exhaustion and respiratory. glad shes ok!

[Atticus Finch]

2 minutes ago, 181pl said:

When I personally know 12 people who are triple vaccinated and got Covid (albeit mild except one elderly family member in the hospital) its not anecdotal.

This is the dictionary definition of anecdotal.

You're a moron.

[Atticus Finch]

7 minutes ago, 181pl said:

If u left your abode and observed with your own eyes you may figure things out Einstein…

Classic.

After thoroughly exposing this clown with facts, data and math, he responds that I need to go out and observe with my own eyes!

Because that's a much better method than dispassionate viewing of data and cold, hard math.

[181pl]

Just now, Atticus Finch said:

This is the dictionary definition of anecdotal.

You're a moron.

You are a fucking 🤡. There are millions of infected people who are fully vaccinated. To claim otherwise is dishonest and dangerous. You should quarantine from humanity for a decade. 

[Atticus Finch]

6 minutes ago, badrouter said:

I can't recall ever consciously thinking, "Man, I've got to defend warrior". lol

Maybe it wasn't conscious but you did it.

👇

On 12/30/2021 at 2:49 PM, badrouter said:

This marks your absolute low point on this forum. You posted data from TRIALS, completed in a different calendar year (2020). Those data will remain what they are forever, as those trials are complete. But, any random moron recognizes that neither Delta nor Omicron variants were around in 2020. Both variants are many times more transmissible than what was floating around during the trials. There's abundant information available detailing the waning effectiveness of the vaccines at preventing infection with Delta and Omicron. You have to realize this, which means you're the liar here. 

On 12/30/2021 at 6:39 PM, badrouter said:

The information is, by definition, outdated. It is from clinical trials conducted well over a year ago, prior to the emergence of either Delta or Omicron. That someone updated the web page it is on doesn't have anything to do with the results of those clinical trials. Those results will remain precisely what they were, forever. 

But, one does not need to seek out any special data to draw the conclusion that the vaccines now do very little to prevent infection: A year ago, we had zero members of the public vaccinated. Now, more than sixty (60) percent of the population is fully vaccinated. The result: A higher case rate NOW than at any other point in the pandemic.

YES, people are MUCH more able to be protected against severe disease and death. And, YES, that is significant. NO, that does not change anything I said above.

 

[181pl]

1 minute ago, Atticus Finch said:

Classic.

After thoroughly exposing this clown with facts, data and math, he responds that I need to go out and observe with my own eyes!

Because that's a  much better method than dispassionate viewing of data and cold, hard math.

You have serious mental illness. Just don’t harm yourself.

[Atticus Finch]

2 minutes ago, 181pl said:

You are a fucking 🤡. 

This is your response when told that you don't know the definition of anecdotal.

[Atticus Finch]

3 minutes ago, 181pl said:

There are millions of infected people who are fully vaccinated. To claim otherwise is dishonest and dangerous

Nobody has claimed otherwise.

In fact, I already did the math for you.

👇

37 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

Because you seriously misunderstand science, math and logic.

Since the claim of 100% effectiveness was never made by anyone, your statements are not relevant at all to the actual issue.

Even if the effectiveness of the vaccines were exactly the same as the efficacy in the trials (which also has never been claimed) then 5% of people could still get COVID, be hospitalized or die.

5% of 200 million is 10 million.

So saying that you know 30 people who got COVID after being vaccinated is literally meaningless.

The point is that "millions of people" being infected after being vaccinated means nothing. It's a statistical certainty.

Since nobody ever claimed 100% effectiveness your claim means nothing.

The fact that you still haven't grasped this point is embarrassing. 

[Atticus Finch]

5 minutes ago, 181pl said:

You have serious mental illness. Just don’t harm yourself.

You're just a moron who insists on public humiliation.

[Atticus Finch]

I love how Warrior is left to like other people's posts because his limited avenue of attack has been thoroughly shut down.

Too bad that the posts he's liking are of equally moronic people making similarly dumb claims.

[badrouter]

8 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

You argued that what I presented was "old" information.

So now I've provided both efficacy in trials and effectiveness in the real world.

Somehow you claim that none of it refutes anything you've said.

The 94/95% efficacy against infection is old. It is the clinical trials data, from 2020.

"Effectiveness in the real world" is far more vague, or subjective. When it comes to preventing severe illness or death, they are incredibly effective. When it comes to testing positive for SARS-CoV-2 particles in the nose, the emergence of Delta and especially Omicron have rendered them pretty useless. 

Hence the need for all of us to confront the following question: Why do we continue to give a fuck about cases, when hospitalizations and deaths for those who've taken advantage of abundantly available tools is close to nil? 

Here are some of the reasons:

- the media benefits from hysteria-induced clicks and "engagement", so amplifying cases increases hysteria and thus benefits media

- there's a neurotic tendency among many to be attracted to panic and doom. It's why a side of the highway opposite of a crash also slows down: people can't look away from the crash

- Public health leadership is simply incapable of accepting there will be adverse outcomes for anyone, and thus is inclined to pursue unwise goals like "zero covid".

- The far left end of the political spectrum, by FAR the most vocal and prominently amplified voices, wants wholesale societal Revolution, "equity". They actively cheer on the destruction of systems and institutions, they LOVE all of the disruption and destruction caused by closures, cancellations and lockdowns.

- A large portion of the population has simply given up, and tuned all of it out. This means that literally anything can continue to occur, and those people will not be aware of it or resist it at all. 

Put all of that together, and that's how we end up in this bizarre place. 

[badrouter]

20 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

You claim that the data is old but then when presented with the newest data you claim that we need to wait for more data.

Classic.

It is obvious to everyone that Omicron is a complete game changer. It didn't arrive here until December, and January is projected to be the apex. Surely, you're aware of the huge number of fully vaccinated, completely "cautious" people like Elizabeth Warren, Cory Booker, and Lloyd Austin all testing positive.  

[badrouter]

16 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

This is rich.

"That data is from clinical trials and can't be trusted!

(Presented with real-world effectiveness data)

"Uhh, we need to wait for more data!"

(Told that there are 200 million data points in the real world)

"Uhh, what's that!

(Points away and runs)

I didn't say the data from trials can't be trusted. I said it is outdated, because the emergence of Delta and Omicron variants long after the completion of the trials makes the data outdated. We can trust that Georgia really was 12-0, and really did shut down all of the opposing offenses it faced those 12 games. That's real data, and speaks to the quality of the Georgia team. But, they got boat raced by Alabama in game 13, and so their stats through just 12 games don't tell the whole story.

[Warrior]

9 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

I love how Warrior is left to like other people's posts because his limited avenue of attack has been thoroughly shut down.

Too bad that the posts he's liking are of equally moronic people making similarly dumb claims.

You’ve posted over 11,000 times on a HS message board in the last 2+ years. You’re calling me out?…haha comical. 

[badrouter]

18 minutes ago, Atticus Finch said:

This is the dictionary definition of anecdotal.

You're a moron.

It is anecdotal. But, so would observing a few people washed to shore during a tsunami and concluding there will be many more dead. You see the massive wave coming from as far as the eye can see, you can safely bet that, once the damage is fully accounted for, it will be significantly larger than the mere anecdotes you observe directly. 

It should be obvious that, once we account for the Omicron wave, we'll see massive amounts of vaccinated people testing positive.  

[Atticus Finch]

13 minutes ago, badrouter said:

The 94/95% efficacy against infection is old. It is the clinical trials data, from 2020.

"Effectiveness in the real world" is far more vague, or subjective. 

"You can't use efficacy in trials! It's old data!"

(Presents effectiveness data from November 2021)

"That's vague and subjective!"

😄

[Atticus Finch]

14 minutes ago, badrouter said:

Hence the need for all of us to confront the following question: Why do we continue to give a fuck about cases, when hospitalizations and deaths for those who've taken advantage of abundantly available tools is close to nil? 

I don't recall anybody arguing this point and, in fact, the protocols are changing regarding this.

You're arguing with yourself because all of your other silly avenues have been shut.

[Atticus Finch]

12 minutes ago, badrouter said:

It is obvious to everyone that Omicron is a complete game changer. It didn't arrive here until December, and January is projected to be the apex. Surely, you're aware of the huge number of fully vaccinated, completely "cautious" people like Elizabeth Warren, Cory Booker, and Lloyd Austin all testing positive.  

Omicron has proven to be less fatal that previous strains.

So if you're uninterested in mere cases then it shouldn't be that big a deal to you.

[Atticus Finch]

11 minutes ago, badrouter said:

I didn't say the data from trials can't be trusted. I said it is outdated, because the emergence of Delta and Omicron variants long after the completion of the trials makes the data outdated. 

badrouter arguing semantics now.

Here he is saying, basically, that the trial data can't be trusted.

👇

On 12/30/2021 at 2:49 PM, badrouter said:

This marks your absolute low point on this forum. You posted data from TRIALS, completed in a different calendar year (2020). Those data will remain what they are forever, as those trials are complete. But, any random moron recognizes that neither Delta nor Omicron variants were around in 2020. Both variants are many times more transmissible than what was floating around during the trials. There's abundant information available detailing the waning effectiveness of the vaccines at preventing infection with Delta and Omicron. You have to realize this, which means you're the liar here. 

On 12/30/2021 at 6:39 PM, badrouter said:

The information is, by definition, outdated. It is from clinical trials conducted well over a year ago, prior to the emergence of either Delta or Omicron. That someone updated the web page it is on doesn't have anything to do with the results of those clinical trials. Those results will remain precisely what they were, forever. 

But, one does not need to seek out any special data to draw the conclusion that the vaccines now do very little to prevent infection: A year ago, we had zero members of the public vaccinated. Now, more than sixty (60) percent of the population is fully vaccinated. The result: A higher case rate NOW than at any other point in the pandemic.

YES, people are MUCH more able to be protected against severe disease and death. And, YES, that is significant. NO, that does not change anything I said above.