AztecPadre Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 2 hours ago, HawgGoneIt said: I think I have to agree with 181. It's down to about four teams, all private schools with a stacked roster and no depth. I think the pollsters are placing far too much emphasis on talent and forgetting that depth can in fact trump talent. It's obvious year after year. The rankings are pretty much a farce due to that imo. We aren't seeing these small roster stacked privates playing the best depth squads. They are mostly playing all among themselves and all of their rankings are elevated due to that. Rankings elevated in the preseason equals higher finishes and MNC's if they don't just bomb. Trying to understand what you mean by depth. What schools that have "depth" are you talking about that do not have a chance at the MNC? Ok reread your post. You're saying MD and SJB do not have depth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 The brains on this thread... Are you ready for more? Regards, AllKnowingAsshole Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 7 minutes ago, AztecPadre said: Trying to understand what you mean by depth. What schools that have "depth" are you talking about that do not have a chance at the MNC? Ok reread your post. You're saying MD and SJB do not have depth? Yes. Not equivalent to teams like Allen, Grayson, Colquitt etc. Their starting roster may be prettier but, they fall off quickly after. It's the nature of how it works with tutition assistance and whatever. It's why we read the fans of those types of schools bragging about transfers year after year. With depth, the guy that is second on the rotation during games is next year's starter. See where I'm coming from? I need to see Mater Dei play Allen, or Grayson or Colquitt to see proof that the big starting roster can compete with the depth. We never see those matchups. I think the starting rosters are getting far too much credit in the rankings. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 The times we have seen these pretty rosters play big publics with depth, hasn't went well for the pretty roster for the most part. We aren't seeing these games when both teams are at their peak either. Examples in my immediate recent memory... Colquitt vs. Bishop Sullivan Sullivan had a beautiful starting roster and got cleaned up against a rebuilding Colquitt. Depth destroyed them imo. Colquitt had nowhere near the starting talent according to the ranking sites. The private school fan argument was, Sullivan isn't a power private. Not a big name. Colquitt vs. AHP Colquitt fresh off of graduating everyone still took them to the ragged edge. Nobody can argue that AHP wasn't a power private. Depth almost got them. Almost. Colquitt was breaking in a new set of starters all the way around. Looking at those examples I have a hard time thinking that for all the big talk and rankings etc., that a "big name power private" would make much difference against the tremendous depth of this year's Colquitt, Allen etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extremely Humble Posted July 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 36 minutes ago, AztecPadre said: I wouldn't go that far. They have not played the the caliber of teams like a Cen10, to be able to claim one of the best offenses. They do have some very good skill players, but I would not put Folsom at an elite level for this year just yet. Lets see how they do in their first game of the year and let the year play out. Folsom is very good, IMO. Just would like to see them take on at least 1 top 25 team before calling them elite. Folsom has holes for sure on the defense and lines but their offense is elite. Very similar to Cen10. You're right we'll get to see first game of the season how good they are since DLS has a very solid squad this season. Pitt looks very solid this season as well. This could be the year DLS goes down. Folsom and Pitt both have a chance, DLS still favorites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AztecPadre Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 22 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Yes. Not equivalent to teams like Allen, Grayson, Colquitt etc. Their starting roster may be prettier but, they fall off quickly after. It's the nature of how it works with tutition assistance and whatever. It's why we read the fans of those types of schools bragging about transfers year after year. With depth, the guy that is second on the rotation during games is next year's starter. See where I'm coming from? I need to see Mater Dei play Allen, or Grayson or Colquitt to see proof that the big starting roster can compete with the depth. We never see those matchups. I think the starting rosters are getting far too much credit in the rankings. I hear ya. So based on the depth that coldcuts, Grayson and Allen have, those teams would beat MD, SJB and IMG? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AztecPadre Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 15 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: The times we have seen these pretty rosters play big publics with depth, hasn't went well for the pretty roster for the most part. We aren't seeing these games when both teams are at their peak either. Examples in my immediate recent memory... Colquitt vs. Bishop Sullivan Sullivan had a beautiful starting roster and got cleaned up against a rebuilding Colquitt. Depth destroyed them imo. Colquitt had nowhere near the starting talent according to the ranking sites. The private school fan argument was, Sullivan isn't a power private. Not a big name. Colquitt vs. AHP Colquitt fresh off of graduating everyone still took them to the ragged edge. Nobody can argue that AHP wasn't a power private. Depth almost got them. Almost. Colquitt was breaking in a new set of starters all the way around. Looking at those examples I have a hard time thinking that for all the big talk and rankings etc., that a "big name power private" would make much difference against the tremendous depth of this year's Colquitt, Allen etc. Or Grayson vs IMG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrepGridiron Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 @HawgGoneIt I can get on board with your roster arguments. There are some going both ways, Centennial v. STA, DLS v. Trinity and others going the other way, Cedar Hill v. Bishop Gorman, IMG v. Grayson, but I see your point. I think Mater Dei might be a bad example. Its the biggest catholic school in California and has always had a large roster. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 I'm saying that the pollsters aren't giving enough credit for depth. Period. And that there isn't enough data to prove it either way. We have Grayson losing to IMG on a very talented year for that Grayson team. It wasn't some blow out though. Then we have Colquitt down nearly taking AHP. Colquitt rebuilding snot bubbling Bishop Sullivan. I really think pollsters are very quick to credit roster talent and much slower to dig a little deeper. Especially in the S.O.S. argument. It could be a lot more difficult to beat a deep but down Colquitt than it is to beat a beautiful roster private school. Yet we see the beautiful roster teams getting higher opponent ratings for the most part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrepGridiron Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 2 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: I'm saying that the pollsters aren't giving enough credit for depth. Period. And that there isn't enough data to prove it either way. We have Grayson losing to IMG on a very talented year for that Grayson team. It wasn't some blow out though. Then we have Colquitt down nearly taking AHP. Colquitt rebuilding snot bubbling Bishop Sullivan. I really think pollsters are very quick to credit roster talent and much slower to dig a little deeper. Especially in the S.O.S. argument. It could be a lot more difficult to beat a deep but down Colquitt than it is to beat a beautiful roster private school. Yet we see the beautiful roster teams getting higher opponent ratings for the most part. Also, don't overlook the value of the pen in those two matchups you listed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 16 minutes ago, AztecPadre said: Or Grayson vs IMG. There were some other things going on in that game. We had new players but most importantly we had a new coach determined to change us from a primarily passing team to a primary run team. In addition to new players, he moved a ton of guys from positions they had played for years to new ones. A prime example is the center. He had started multiple years, had played with Chase since they were young kids, and they had a rhythm working with each other. Herron came in a moved him to guard and put a new center in. There were several missed snaps in that game because it was the first game the QB and center played together. At least one of those missed snaps killed a drive deep in IMG territory. I think it resulted in a turnover but I'd have to go back and look to be sure. Had Herron played to our existing strengths instead of trying to force the makeover on us, I think the outcome would have been different. Had that game occurred later in the season even with the changes instead of our first game, I think the outcome would have been different. Unfortunately for us, he did and it didn't and you can't change that. It is what it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AztecPadre Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Fred said: There were some other things going on in that game. We had new players but most importantly we had a new coach determined to change us from a primarily passing team to a primary run team. In addition to new players, he moved a ton of guys from positions they had played for years to new ones. A prime example is the center. He had started multiple years, had played with Chase since they were young kids, and they had a rhythm working with each other. Herron came in a moved him to guard and put a new center in. There were several missed snaps in that game because it was the first game the QB and center played together. At least one of those missed snaps killed a drive deep in IMG territory. I think it resulted in a turnover but I'd have to go back and look to be sure. Had Herron played to our existing strengths instead of trying to force the makeover on us, I think the outcome would have been different. Had that game occurred later in the season even with the changes instead of our first game, I think the outcome would have been different. Unfortunately for us, he did and it didn't and you can't change that. It is what it is. Not bagging on Grayson. Just replying to hawgs post about elite teams not playing ga. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbiafan Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 50 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Yes. Not equivalent to teams like Allen, Grayson, Colquitt etc. Their starting roster may be prettier but, they fall off quickly after. It's the nature of how it works with tutition assistance and whatever. It's why we read the fans of those types of schools bragging about transfers year after year. With depth, the guy that is second on the rotation during games is next year's starter. See where I'm coming from? I need to see Mater Dei play Allen, or Grayson or Colquitt to see proof that the big starting roster can compete with the depth. We never see those matchups. I think the starting rosters are getting far too much credit in the rankings. Mater Dei last year would have beaten any team, depth or not 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Columbiafan Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 50 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: The times we have seen these pretty rosters play big publics with depth, hasn't went well for the pretty roster for the most part. We aren't seeing these games when both teams are at their peak either. Examples in my immediate recent memory... Colquitt vs. Bishop Sullivan Sullivan had a beautiful starting roster and got cleaned up against a rebuilding Colquitt. Depth destroyed them imo. Colquitt had nowhere near the starting talent according to the ranking sites. The private school fan argument was, Sullivan isn't a power private. Not a big name. Colquitt vs. AHP Colquitt fresh off of graduating everyone still took them to the ragged edge. Nobody can argue that AHP wasn't a power private. Depth almost got them. Almost. Colquitt was breaking in a new set of starters all the way around. Looking at those examples I have a hard time thinking that for all the big talk and rankings etc., that a "big name power private" would make much difference against the tremendous depth of this year's Colquitt, Allen etc. AHP had to bus all the way up there and play in hostile territory Wouldn't have been that close in SFL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 43 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: We have Grayson losing to IMG on a very talented year for that Grayson team. It wasn't some blow out though. Grayson lost by three scores at home. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 44 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Then we have Colquitt down nearly taking AHP. So what you're telling me is that Colquitt lost. At home. And was down by three scores at one point. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 45 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Colquitt rebuilding snot bubbling Bishop Sullivan. Yeah, Bishop Sullivan wasn't any good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, HawgGoneIt said: See where I'm coming from? . Yeah, you're coming from a silly place. I can't believe you just claimed that Colquitt County has better depth than Mater Dei. And did so with seemingly no sarcasm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, HawgGoneIt said: Colquitt vs. Bishop Sullivan Sullivan had a beautiful starting roster and got cleaned up against a rebuilding Colquitt. Depth destroyed them imo. Colquitt had nowhere near the starting talent according to the ranking sites. Again with this. Bishop Sullivan lost because they weren't good. Has nothing to do with your tortured depth vs. pretty roster logic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, HawgGoneIt said: Colquitt fresh off of graduating everyone still took them to the ragged edge. Nobody can argue that AHP wasn't a power private. Depth almost got them. Almost So your "depth" public school lost. And was down three scores at home. But this is a win for your argument? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 1 hour ago, HawgGoneIt said: Especially in the S.O.S. argument. It could be a lot more difficult to beat a deep but down Colquitt than it is to beat a beautiful roster private school. Yet we see the beautiful roster teams getting higher opponent ratings for the most part. What ass are you pulling this Colquitt depth from? A rural public school in a one-school county somehow has more depth than some of the best teams in modern high school football history? Mater Dei's 1's would beat Colquitt's. Mater Dei's 2's would beat Colquitt's. Mater Dei's JV would beat Colquitt's. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 7 minutes ago, Guccifer said: Mater Dei's 1's would beat Colquitt's. Mater Dei's 2's would beat Colquitt's. Mater Dei's JV would beat Colquitt's. And what ass did you pull that info from? Give some proof. Your argument comes from nowhere with zero data to back it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 1 minute ago, HawgGoneIt said: And what ass did you pull that info from? The same one in which you got your entire depth argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guccifer Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Give some proof. Your argument comes from nowhere with zero data to back it up. An argument that can be asserted without evidence can be refuted without evidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted July 18, 2018 Report Share Posted July 18, 2018 There is at least some data to back up my claims. Your argument is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.