Who is the greatest sports athlete of all time.?

[bigrobstercraws]

1 minute ago, AztecPadre said:

Agreed.  That's why Barry US Bonds should not be mentioned as greatest. 

Disagree. We let cheaters of ever era in the Hall sans the steroid era. That's not a good reason since they got their stats vs. other players on roids. 

[HSFBfan]

Just now, bigrobstercraws said:

Disagree. We let cheaters of ever era in the Hall sans the steroid era. That's not a good reason since they got their stats vs. other players on roids. 

Give me an example of someone who cheated the game like Barry bonds that's in the HOF

[AztecPadre]

1 minute ago, bigrobstercraws said:

Disagree. We let cheaters of ever era in the Hall sans the steroid era. That's not a good reason since they got their stats vs. other players on roids. 

I don't know.  It gets sticky there.  Many used, but he just looked so weird with that huge head of his.  lol

[maxchoboian]

12 minutes ago, bigrobstercraws said:

Gretzky dominated hockey more so. As the all-time leading goal scorer, he would be the all-time points leader without scoring a single goal.

Agreed. Gretzky was NHL MVP eight years in a row, and nine times altogether. All-time leader in both goals scored AND assists. I realize he wasn't going against competition as impressive as a Kobayashi, but the other players in the NHL weren't bad.

[old_e]

8 minutes ago, AztecPadre said:

Tyson or Ali in their prime?

I'm gonna have to go with Ali. Most of the boxers Tyson faced in the early part of his career were like DLS opponents during the  streak, they were scared going in. Once Tyson faced boxers with a chin and punched back, he struggled.  Evander Holyfield was passed his prime and gave Tyson all kinds of trouble. 

[181pl]

Just now, bigrobstercraws said:

Gretzky dominated hockey more so. As the all-time leading goal scorer, he would be the all-time points leader without scoring a single goal. 

Also, Joey Chestnut won 9 out of 10 Nathan Hot Dog Eating Contests. Nobody has come remotely close to it. Kobayashi only could do it 4 times. 

Not really. For that to be true, Gretz would also have to a Conn Smythe caliber goalie.

[bigrobstercraws]

12 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

Give me an example of someone who cheated the game like Barry bonds that's in the HOF

So outside the steroid era?

Gaylord Perry was a notorious cheater with foreign substances

Hank Aaron admitted to using speed just like most players of his era used during games. Another HOFer of that era even sold speed to his teammates in Willie Stargell

Rogers Hornsby, the amazing Second Baseman of the St Louis Cardinals who batted over .400 three times in his career said “I’ve been in pro baseball since 1914 and I’ve cheated, or watched someone on my team cheat, in practically every game. You’ve got to cheat.”

Yankees great Whitey Ford admitted his cheating. “I didn’t begin cheating until late in my career, when I needed something to help me survive. I didn’t cheat when I won the twenty-five games in 1961. I don’t want anybody to get any ideas and take my Cy Young Award away. And I didn’t cheat in 1963 when I won twenty-four games. Well, maybe a little.”

Hank Greenberg, one of the premier power hitters of his day discussed how the stealing of signs helped him. “I loved that. I was the greatest hitter in the world when I knew what kind of pitch was coming up.”

 The Hall is full of cheaters who used what ever was available in their era to cheat. It is hypocritical to disallow them when baseball turned a blind eye to every cheater before the roid era. There are plenty of more I could list.

[181pl]

Also Ruth hit more homers one year than every other team by himself. Granted it was only 29but it was the DEAD ball era. The next year he hit 54. 

[bigrobstercraws]

3 minutes ago, 181pl said:

Not really. For that to be true, Gretz would also have to a Conn Smythe caliber goalie.

See Hall of Famer Grant Fuhr

[bigrobstercraws]

12 minutes ago, AztecPadre said:

I don't know.  It gets sticky there.  Many used, but he just looked so weird with that huge head of his.  lol

It's back to normal now that he isn't juicing. lol

[HSFBfan]

5 minutes ago, bigrobstercraws said:

So outside the steroid era?

Gaylord Perry was a notorious cheater with foreign substances

Hank Aaron admitted to using speed just like most players of his era used during games. Another HOFer of that era even sold speed to his teammates in Willie Stargell

Rogers Hornsby, the amazing Second Baseman of the St Louis Cardinals who batted over .400 three times in his career said “I’ve been in pro baseball since 1914 and I’ve cheated, or watched someone on my team cheat, in practically every game. You’ve got to cheat.”

Yankees great Whitey Ford admitted his cheating. “I didn’t begin cheating until late in my career, when I needed something to help me survive. I didn’t cheat when I won the twenty-five games in 1961. I don’t want anybody to get any ideas and take my Cy Young Award away. And I didn’t cheat in 1963 when I won twenty-four games. Well, maybe a little.”

Hank Greenberg, one of the premier power hitters of his day discussed how the stealing of signs helped him. “I loved that. I was the greatest hitter in the world when I knew what kind of pitch was coming up.”

 The Hall is full of cheaters who used what ever was available in their era to cheat. It is hypocritical to disallow them when baseball turned a blind eye to every cheater before the roid era. There are plenty of more I could list.

I cant see speed as being helpful on the baseball diamond but thanks for the examples but to use steroids to beat the sacrificial numbers in baseball is not something I can support 

[bigrobstercraws]

2 minutes ago, HSFBfan said:

I cant see speed as being helpful on the baseball diamond but thanks for the examples but to use steroids to beat the sacrificial numbers in baseball is not something I can support 

Would these cheaters of the past used steroids if they had them in their eras?
I say yes.

That's why I'm not for banning them. How do you feel about Pete Rose?

[181pl]

22 minutes ago, bigrobstercraws said:

See Hall of Famer Grant Fuhr

Combine them and you'd have hockey Ruth.

[CaliNorth]

1 hour ago, AztecPadre said:

As greatest athlete ever?  No way.  Largest head?  Yes. 

As a 7 time mvp, greatest home run hitter of all time, greatest on base percentage of all time by wide margin, golden glove I don't know how many times, 40-40 club, greatest overall hitting percentage for a 3 yr stretch ( greater than Ruth or anyone ever ) 3,000 hit club, etc. The guy was head and shoulders above anyone in his era. Was Jordanesque in his sport, just like Gretzky. I don't know how you could not put this guy in conversation. Just like old timers felt they were  privileged to see Ruth, I feel the same about Bonds. There is none like him. The greatest in his sport. Just to think that 2 of the all time greats in their sports, Bonds and Brady, came from same Serra high school. Impressive.

[CaliNorth]

46 minutes ago, 181pl said:

Also Ruth hit more homers one year than every other team by himself. Granted it was only 29but it was the DEAD ball era. The next year he hit 54. 

Yea, but how many more carreer at bats did Ruth have ?

[181pl]

Ruth had far less at bats than Aaron and Bonds. Less games and first few years he was primarily a pitcher.

[AztecPadre]

40 minutes ago, CaliNorth said:

As a 7 time mvp, greatest home run hitter of all time, greatest on base percentage of all time by wide margin, golden glove I don't know how many times, 40-40 club, greatest overall hitting percentage for a 3 yr stretch ( greater than Ruth or anyone ever ) 3,000 hit club, etc. The guy was head and shoulders above anyone in his era. Was Jordanesque in his sport, just like Gretzky. I don't know how you could not put this guy in conversation. Just like old timers felt they were  privileged to see Ruth, I feel the same about Bonds. There is none like him. The greatest in his sport. Just to think that 2 of the all time greats in their sports, Bonds and Brady, came from same Serra high school. Impressive.

When you are taking the most high tech super performance steroids not even known to man, I would hope he could all that and some.  I cannot get passed that.  i was a fan of his when he was on the Pirates.  50lbs and 4 hate sizes smaller.  But once he made the transformation to what he became? No respect.  I have seen him around the last few years at social events and a couple of high school football games and he looks way different now.  He is so much smaller and back to regular looking. 

[AztecPadre]

42 minutes ago, CaliNorth said:

Yea, but how many more carreer at bats did Ruth have ?

The true homerun king was Josh Gibson.  He hit over 800.

[bigrobstercraws]

25 minutes ago, AztecPadre said:

The true homerun king was Josh Gibson.  He hit over 800.

Sadaharu Oh hit 868 for the Yomiuri Giants. 

[AztecPadre]

2 minutes ago, bigrobstercraws said:

Sadaharu Oh hit 868 for the Yomiuri Giants. 

Yeah but thats Japanese league.  The negro leagues routinely beat the MLB all star teams. 

[bigrobstercraws]

6 minutes ago, AztecPadre said:

Yeah but thats Japanese league.  The negro leagues routinely beat the MLB all star teams. 

True. Japanese League isn't on par with MLB. The Negro Leagues were its equal and at times better.

[golfaddict1]

Buck O'Neill interview with Ken Burns / PBS   https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/baseball/shadowball/oneil.html

Is there one moment in all of baseball you wish you could have seen? 
 

I wish I could have been there when Babe Ruth pointed and hit the ball out of the ballpark in the 1932 World Series. I wish I could have seen that. But I did see something I admired just about as much, with Satchel Paige and Babe Ruth. This was in Chicago, after Ruth came out of the major leagues. He was barnstorming, playing with different teams, and he played us. Satchel was pitching and Ruth was hitting. Satchel threw Ruth the ball and Ruth hit the ball, must have been 500 feet, off of Satchel. Satchel looked at Ruth all the way around the bases and when Ruth got to home plate, you know who shook his hand? Satchel Paige shook Ruth's hand at home plate.

They stopped the game and waited, he and Satchel talking, until the kid went out, got the ball, brought it back and Satchel had Babe Ruth autograph that ball for him. That was some kind of moment.

[golfaddict1]

 

[golfaddict1]

 

[CaliNorth]

6 hours ago, AztecPadre said:

When you are taking the most high tech super performance steroids not even known to man, I would hope he could all that and some.  I cannot get passed that.  i was a fan of his when he was on the Pirates.  50lbs and 4 hate sizes smaller.  But once he made the transformation to what he became? No respect.  I have seen him around the last few years at social events and a couple of high school football games and he looks way different now.  He is so much smaller and back to regular looking. 

But couldn't you argue that all of the football players in 70's up to present have been on steroids ? Baseball is still rampant with illegal supplements. All the sports, including tennis, b-ball, soccer, etc., are rampant with it. I'm almost positive Manning took it on Broncos to help heal his neck injury. Kobe, Lebron, all are doing stuff. I understand people want to single out Bonds because he was the greatest, but that is the point I'm trying to say. He was the greatest.