HSFBfan Posted March 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 1 minute ago, World Citizen said: I guess I missed your original question. I'll go back and read. My point still stands though. Yes you have a point. Question again. I woke up in the morning and went to work. Am I successful? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUFORDGAWOLVES Posted March 15, 2018 Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 Just now, HSFBfan said: LMAOOO cat is a great guy. I just couldn’t resist that one! You know I don’t have a filter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Citizen Posted March 15, 2018 Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 On 3/9/2018 at 8:33 AM, noonereal said: But it also a bit alarming I have read many , many of your post and you are truly a centrist, as am I. Independent in thought. We are considered liberal extremists by the Trumpets. When extreme passes for normal for so many, we have a problem, Houston. It's a zero sum game. In every instance. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSFBfan Posted March 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 Just now, BUFORDGAWOLVES said: I just couldn’t resist that one! You know I don’t have a filter! Neither do I 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Citizen Posted March 15, 2018 Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 1 minute ago, HSFBfan said: Yes you have a point. Question again. I woke up in the morning and went to work. Am I successful? If you say so. Sucess can mean different things for people. Personally, success means to live a happy life and being kind and having a positive impact on people. Nothing to do with money or status or possessions. I don't think anybody can define what is successful for YOU. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSFBfan Posted March 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 Just now, World Citizen said: If you say so. Sucess can mean different things for people. Personally, success means to live a happy life and being kind and having a positive impact on people. Nothing to do with money or status or possessions. I don't think anybody can define what is successful for YOU. Exactly my point. Your success is whatever you determine your success to be. If you wanna make x amount of money to be success then you have to do that. If you wanna make people happy to be success than do that. Like you stated its completely up to you to determine what is success. Success can be waking up and going to work or school. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Citizen Posted March 15, 2018 Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 9 minutes ago, dbcaptiron said: ABSOLUTELY true... But I would posit that in more cases than not, it would be ones "own drive and skills" that is more the determining factor (than other contributing ones)..... so unless you only deal in absolutes.......just sayin... Absolutely. If a person does not take the lead and have the drive, any growth, no matter what form it takes, would be hollow. 100% agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSFBfan Posted March 15, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2018 49 minutes ago, World Citizen said: Absolutely. If a person does not take the lead and have the drive, any growth, no matter what form it takes, would be hollow. 100% agree. So like you said you have to agree with DB statement why do we have the no child left behind thing if we still have it. Why push a student through school that has no drive and doesn't want to be there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 58 minutes ago, World Citizen said: It's a zero sum game. In every instance. . sure when you add all the pieces together...but you can't have pieces supporting flat edges claiming they are not border pieces in an effort to skew the stew.... That's what 'intellectually dishonest' people do....when claiming 'middle support'... ....generally if you have middle support (or any really) you don't have to 'claim' anything ( or try to frame where you stand for others) on any issue..... just saying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Citizen Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 2 hours ago, dbcaptiron said: sure when you add all the pieces together...but you can't have pieces supporting flat edges claiming they are not border pieces in an effort to skew the stew.... That's what 'intellectually dishonest' people do....when claiming 'middle support'... ....generally if you have middle support (or any really) you don't have to 'claim' anything ( or try to frame where you stand for others) on any issue..... just saying... I guess what I should have made clear is, concerning our politics, it has become a zero sum game. This has nothing to do with people actually trying to solve problems in any sincere way. I hope it's obvious that our politics really isn't concerned with ideological positions anymore. It has been either win or lose. It started with Gingrich imo but became public knowledge when McConnel and his gang of merry men met and made a pact to deny Obama at every turn. Give him no victories regardless if it was originally one of their ideas or if it would have helped their constituents. These merry men also made a pact with Grover Norquist about no tax increases. Signed a pledge. They also signed a pledge with those who elected them but that was not a high priority pledge. This says nothing about how I feel about compromise and working with opposing ideas. And searching for a "middle" as you say, is not the goal. Its just a unspecific place where compromise usually ends up. It could end anywhere though which is why the middle is not a metric I would use. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, World Citizen said: This says nothing about how I feel about compromise and working with opposing ideas. And searching for a "middle" as you say, is not the goal. Its just a unspecific place where compromise usually ends up. It could end anywhere though which is why the middle is not a metric I would use. Hear hear....Gold I don't often find common ground with you, but could not have said it better myself... I would also add that as one person it's insane to think that for every differing issue, your opinion would fall consistently on the same spot along any (imaginary or individually framed) left/right line.... Not a metric I try to use either......(I try to stick to point and policy to develop my own opinion) good post 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarterBlue Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 18 hours ago, dbcaptiron said: Great stuff Darter....I gotta AGREE with the majority of this... I don't think Trump will show much humility even if he holds more than is shown......but to a certain degree, I'm not sure how much he 'should' in the position. Yes wealth is indeed a weapon ...and to go to battle without it you can be hamstringed...But that weapon (like most) is a double edged sword. Certainly it can be corrosive (it's possibly the top corrosive element), but that is not always the case.... for those who have learned how to properly wield that sword without cutting themselves...(or even those who have cut themselves and know the pain) And as obviously I don't have answers as to Trumps true goals, I can't debate that and not trying to stick up for any particular president, but when the 'position' calls for securing the wealth of the nation (as more of a higher priority these days), I kind of like the 'silicon valley' approach....... hiring CEO's that have a proven track record of experience in startups or companies that went thru complete build/failure/build cycles....the more the better...(Arguably Silicon Valley would not exist as it does, without this Failure badge mentality) Call me crazy, but 'orange hair' aside, this long in life (and lifelong until he wanted/needed to make a run in politics) Democrat Trump seems the most suited on paper thru this lens than any other president i can think of, off hand... Now I can absolutely understand why people freak at the orange hair, but how does everyone make the jump when viewing a flailing sword being thrown, to 'knowing' his 'true' inner intentions??? As I can't know, I can only go by the battle cry being chanted in public by the sword flailer...... I only support the policies being promoted in the battle, and not any specific sword carrier.....Kind of like rooting for the football TEAM and not johnny QB (people that root for 'players' in politics are most times in for a huge let down). Arguing policy I find much more productive than trying to stick up for orange hair..... And find that those that point to said hair, intentionally being counterproductive... 1. A leader should project strength. However, he/she should also be able to quickly acknowledge error, correct it, and move on. I personally feel DJT does not have the capacity to do so. So right off the bat, to me that spells weakness not strength. 2. I agree with the third paragraph. The only thing I would add is that care needs to be exercised to ensure that the founder(s) who often exhibit true vision are not totally marginalized. The history of Apple and its dramatic rescue by Jobs from the mistakes made by Scully in the mid 1990s comes to mind. 3. Trump certainly has the life experiences, at least on paper. However, to me, and I could be wrong, he is lacking in temperament. In many respects he exhibits traits I saw in some of the contemporaries I grew up with in Southside, Kingston, Jamaica. Many of those individuals were ultimately betrayed by those in the very community they grew up in, as they were deemed too unstable to represent its best interests. Few lived to see 30 ... 4. I think DJT has left enough of a track record along the way to give clear insights into his intentions. It's been my experience that individuals that leave a similar track record exist solely to serve their own ambitions and for their own gratification. I will credit him with identifying and exploiting the economic malaise experienced by a large segment of the population. However, I doubt very much that he has that segment's best interests at heart. 5. I disagree with the policy vs sword carrier comment. I strongly feel that the sword carrier needs to reflect certain traits to effectively promote the policy. In that sense I totally get the concerns expressed by Senator Sasse during the Republican primaries. If I were a conservative, I would have felt the same way. 6. In general, I more or less agree with your final sentence. However, I do feel that in this case, the hair says something about the man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 19 hours ago, dbcaptiron said: And find that those that point to said hair, intentionally being counterproductive... 44 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: 6. In general, I more or less agree with your final sentence. However, I do feel that in this case, the hair says something about the man. As Trump has taught the class to criticize obvious abnormalities (like being challenged, being fat, short....) isn't it appropriate to do the same in concerns to him? And yes, your point is valid. The fact that Donald is orange in skin and hair while disguising being bald and fat is very much a part of a conversation unless you don't realize how profound these outward manifestations of charterer are. So the poster you quoted was flat out wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 @dbcaptiron I always liked the young grasshopper and the show Kung Fu. Then the star was discovered naked and strangled, supposedly by his own hand in some auto-erotic episode in Thailand. I just can't seem to watch the show in the same light anymore. After all that Shaolin training, he still didn't have the sense that god gave a... grasshopper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, noonereal said: As Trump has taught the class to criticize obvious abnormalities (like being challenged, being fat, short....) isn't it appropriate to do the same in concerns to him? And yes, your point is valid. The fact that Donald is orange in skin and hair while disguising being bald and fat is very much a part of a conversation unless you don't realize how profound these outward manifestations of charterer are. So the poster you quoted was flat out wrong. The guy certainly deserves every little dig that people want to throw at him. His supporters be damned. He makes up funny names, and picks on physical attributes of others pretty consistently, even as president. He should get as good as he gives. It's certainly all valid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noonereal Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 9 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: The guy certainly deserves every little dig that people want to throw at him. His supporters be damned. He makes up funny names, and picks on physical attributes of others pretty consistently, even as president. He should get as good as he gives. It's certainly all valid. He can't take it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawgGoneIt Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 Just now, noonereal said: He can't take it though. Of course not. That takes a truly brave and secure person. Two qualities he has yet to show, if he has any little grain of either one in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 Again great post, I agree with most of it... 28 minutes ago, DarterBlue said: 1. A leader should project strength. However, he/she should also be able to quickly acknowledge error, correct it, and move on. I personally feel DJT does not have the capacity to do so. So right off the bat, to me that spells weakness not strength. << Two words...."You're Fired.." Now if you wanted to say that the narcissist always resists taking personal blame for anything...well I would agree LOL... 2. I agree with the third paragraph. The only thing I would add is that care needs to be exercised to ensure that the founder(s) who often exhibit true vision are not totally marginalized. The history of Apple and its dramatic rescue by Jobs from the mistakes made by Scully in the mid 1990s comes to mind.<<agreed 3. Trump certainly has the life experiences, at least on paper. However, to me, and I could be wrong, he is lacking in temperament.<agreed In many respects he exhibits traits I saw in some of the contemporaries I grew up with in Southside, Kingston, Jamaica. Many of those individuals were ultimately betrayed by those in the very community they grew up in, as they were deemed too unstable to represent its best interests. Few lived to see 30 ...<<can't speak to that, other than to comment that it still seems likely to me that Trump's life experience, age, and current life position (amount of $ wealth vs life expectancy) puts him in a slightly different category. But as you say, I could be dead wrong, and I do tend to give the benefit of the doubt. 4. I think DJT has left enough of a track record along the way to give clear insights into his intentions. It's been my experience that individuals that leave a similar track record exist solely to serve their own ambitions and for their own gratification.<<of course he is serving his own ambitions, it does not really work any other way...I simply view his ambitions as catering to the narcissistic view of wanting to leave a legacy as more important than his narcissistic need for 'cash' or swindling people at this point. I will credit him with identifying and exploiting the economic malaise experienced by a large segment of the population.<<all politicians do..so maybe he will actually work out as a politician LOL However, I doubt very much that he has that segment's best interests at heart.<<as you said I agree it's 'his own' best interest he serves. My question is, if the ambition is to get his 'nationalistic' people to love his 'legacy', will he serve them well, as well? 5. I disagree with the policy vs sword carrier comment. I strongly feel that the sword carrier needs to reflect certain traits to effectively promote the policy. <<certainly does not hurt LOL. In that sense I totally get the concerns expressed by Senator Sasse during the Republican primaries. If I were a conservative, I would have felt the same way.<<I get what you are saying here, but this has already been rendered moot at this point. Election is over, and the Potus is Trump. You don't like the QB that was drafted, pointing to his inability to throw a spiral or pointing to some dripping snot, does not help the team run the next play... 6. In general, I more or less agree with your final sentence. However, I do feel that in this case, the hair says something about the man. << I do too, but for all intents and purposes if it's not about policy at this point it's counterproductive, and REALLY has less to do with the actual job performance than you seem to think (the public's bar doesn't appear to be that high to me for politicians). Same as me bringing up 'blow jobs in the oval office' a while back...just plain counterproductive in my mind is all... not even getting into those that agree in policy/principle, yet won't support something due to orange hair... Sorry to be long winded...decent convo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 53 minutes ago, noonereal said: As Trump has taught the class to criticize obvious abnormalities (like being challenged, being fat, short....) isn't it appropriate to do the same in concerns to him? And yes, your point is valid. The fact that Donald is orange in skin and hair while disguising being bald and fat is very much a part of a conversation unless you don't realize how profound these outward manifestations of charterer are. So the poster you quoted was flat out wrong. QUACK, Quack, quack... I hate Donald duck.... QUACK, Quack, quack... 42 minutes ago, noonereal said: He can't take it though. QUACK, Quack, quack... and all ducks dammit.... QUACK, Quack, quack... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 52 minutes ago, HawgGoneIt said: Of course not. That takes a truly brave and secure person. Two qualities he has yet to show, if he has any little grain of either one in there. Seriously Hawg, following nooner into his duck swamp? not a good look.... Maybe you should try just embracing the Donald...and following his lead instead..... Join the Trump train as well...a much better look Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 1 hour ago, HawgGoneIt said: @dbcaptiron I always liked the young grasshopper and the show Kung Fu. Then the star was discovered naked and strangled, supposedly by his own hand in some auto-erotic episode in Thailand. I just can't seem to watch the show in the same light anymore. After all that Shaolin training, he still didn't have the sense that god gave a... grasshopper. That's right, forgot about that shit...good memory...I guess you could say he did it to just himself I suppose..... must be that worrying about or remembering that kind of shit was/is not real important to me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat_Scratch Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 On 3/14/2018 at 9:42 PM, dan in daytona said: Is there a miss connect here ? Get an education, save, and do what your heart desires. Sure stay active, but being able to call your own shots 24/7 is one of the great possibilities in anyone's life. Raise that future goal of yours. You live in the greatest country on this planet. Work it right young man. There are many avenues, choose one. Totally agree with Dan here. I started working at 14 for 1.75 an hour 3 days a week to pay my way. I have 5 brothers and a sister, not the traditional 2.5 family. If I wanted something I had to figure out a way to pay for it. I paid my way through college, even though I had some decent scholarships. I stayed close to my family to help out. I worked many years as a laborer, but after 14 years and college I was lucky enough to find a job that was also my hobby. I then worked 30 plus years toward a pension and savings in a 401K. I retired at 58. I paid every debt I owed and gave to those that needed. I'm 65 years old and have traveled the world. I still work, only it's on my terms and I still save half of what I make. I draw SS because SS isn't voluntary, it's mandatory to pay in. I earned it, and I want what I work for back. Life is good if you plan a little, and work toward a long term goal when you reach that goal. Even if you can't afford it, buy a cheap house and fix it up. If it gets too tough, sell it for a profit. Then start over. It's not so hard you can't do it, you just have to want it. 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbcaptiron Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 39 minutes ago, Cat_Scratch said: Totally agree with Dan here. I started working at 14 for 1.75 an hour 3 days a week to pay my way. I have 5 brothers and a sister, not the traditional 2.5 family. If I wanted something I had to figure out a way to pay for it. I paid my way through college, even though I had some decent scholarships. I stayed close to my family to help out. I worked many years as a laborer, but after 14 years and college I was lucky enough to find a job that was also my hobby. I then worked 30 plus years toward a pension and savings in a 401K. I retired at 58. I paid every debt I owed and gave to those that needed. I'm 65 years old and have traveled the world. I still work, only it's on my terms and I still save half of what I make. I draw SS because SS isn't voluntary, it's mandatory to pay in. I earned it, and I want what I work for back. Life is good if you plan a little, and work toward a long term goal when you reach that goal. Even if you can't afford it, buy a cheap house and fix it up. If it gets too tough, sell it for a profit. Then start over. It's not so hard you can't do it, you just have to want it. Could not agree more... Looks like we have led similar lives....rewards have been very good, for all the hard work (and usually is when done in this fashion). Kudos... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat_Scratch Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 21 minutes ago, dbcaptiron said: Could not agree more... Looks like we have led similar lives....rewards have been very good, for all the hard work (and usually is when done in this fashion). Kudos... Thanks, and Kudos to you also... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
World Citizen Posted March 16, 2018 Report Share Posted March 16, 2018 10 hours ago, HawgGoneIt said: @dbcaptiron I always liked the young grasshopper and the show Kung Fu. Then the star was discovered naked and strangled, supposedly by his own hand in some auto-erotic episode in Thailand. I just can't seem to watch the show in the same light anymore. After all that Shaolin training, he still didn't have the sense that god gave a... grasshopper. Loved that show...until I found out it was supposed to be Bruce Lee's role. Ironic one of Lee's goals was introducing Chinese culture to the west and Hollywood pulled a Hollywood on him and thought him too Chinese for American audiences. Still shake my head on that. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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