Trump Tariffs Could Devastate Spartanburg, Tuscaloosa w/ 50% Retaliation

[BigDrop]

Spartanburg has 8,000 jobs in BMW’s largest plant and Mercedes has 4,000 in Alabama.  The Chinese have announced a 50% tariff on all cars made in the U. S.  Both BMW and Mercedes have several models which are only built in the U.S.  There will be other foreign manufacturers who build here that will suffer on what they sell to China.

Tariffs are incredibly risky.  

What Trump is willing to risk is not the same as many others.  The plants I noted above have thousands of others who work for subcontractors .  I have not even mentioned the American auto workers.

Then, of course, there are Wal Mart, Costco, Amazon and others which carry numerous Chinese manufactured goods which Trump will place a tariff on dramatically raising the price to us.  

Tariffs are incredibly risky...and expensive to everyone reading this.

Note the Smoot Hawley Tariff which exacerbated the Great Depression.

And, just announced:  the Ravens have signed RGIII....

[CCBlackhatter]

Wrong section there Big Drop. Lol

We have an OT/Political Board now, ya know?

[AztecPadre]

1 hour ago, BigDrop said:

Spartanburg has 8,000 jobs in BMW’s largest plant and Mercedes has 4,000 in Alabama.  The Chinese have announced a 50% tariff on all cars made in the U. S.  Both BMW and Mercedes have several models which are only built in the U.S.  There will be other foreign manufacturers who build here that will suffer on what they sell to China.

Tariffs are incredibly risky.  

What Trump is willing to risk is not the same as many others.  The plants I noted above have thousands of others who work for subcontractors .  I have not even mentioned the American auto workers.

Then, of course, there are Wal Mart, Costco, Amazon and others which carry numerous Chinese manufactured goods which Trump will place a tariff on dramatically raising the price to us.  

Tariffs are incredibly risky...and expensive to everyone reading this.

Note the Smoot Hawley Tariff which exacerbated the Great Depression.

And, just announced:  the Ravens have signed RGIII....

Yeah this kat does not care about anybody except trump. He's only after Amazon out of pure jealousy. The founder is not only a real billionaire unlike him. But is also a great business man. Unlike him. He's pissed also because he thinks he's the only one who should be making "great" deals. Piece of mierda.  

[Pops]

Would you guys have suggested doing nothing for the trade deficit and unfair trade practices

I get the risk and hear from my son who works for Amazon how trump is screwing up their share price — just curious whether there’s a “should have done this” or you preferred status quo 

[CCBlackhatter]

The left is all for sticking it to big corporations until it's Trump and Amazon.

[Fred]

3 hours ago, AztecPadre said:

Yeah this kat does not care about anybody except trump. He's only after Amazon out of pure jealousy. The founder is not only a real billionaire unlike him. But is also a great business man. Unlike him. He's pissed also because he thinks he's the only one who should be making "great" deals. Piece of mierda.  

Uh, you kow Amazon went years without making a profit and Bezos skated on the benefit of the doubt don't you?  I'm not saying Tump is right on the tariffs, I'm just saying that Amazon and Bezos are exceeding lucky to have made it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonmarkman/2017/05/23/the-amazon-era-no-profits-no-problem/#490ea094437a

Oh but the way, Amazon made $5.7 billion in profit last year.  Guess how much income tax they paid?  $0, zero, zip, nada.  They stand to make an additional $789 million from the new tax breaks.  Bezos' strategy has been to aggressively avoid paying taxes.

https://newrepublic.com/article/147249/amazon-big-tax

Before you go all in on Amazon and Bezos you might want to do a little more research.

[Columbiafan]

6 minutes ago, Fred said:

Uh, you kow Amazon went years without making a profit and Bezos skated on the benefit of the doubt don't you?  I'm not saying Tump is right on the tariffs, I'm just saying that Amazon and Bezos are exceeding lucky to have made it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonmarkman/2017/05/23/the-amazon-era-no-profits-no-problem/#490ea094437a

Oh but the way, Amazon made $5.7 billion in profit last year.  Guess how much income tax they paid?  $0, zero, zip, nada.  They stand to make an additional $789 million from the new tax breaks.  Bezos' strategy has been to aggressively avoid paying taxes.

https://newrepublic.com/article/147249/amazon-big-tax

Before you go all in on Amazon and Bezos you might want to do a little more research.

Trump and his buddies find loopholes on taxes too

 

What's your point? 

[Columbiafan]

I like Amazon 

 

They have stuff that retail stores won't sell anymore and generally whenever i go to somewhere like Walmart i get sent in circles for 30 minutes only to find out it's out of stock 

 

Then i can go on amazon and find it for cheaper and not go through the hassle 

 

 

Amazon is a consumer dream

[BigDrop]

2 hours ago, CCBlackhatter said:

The left is all for sticking it to big corporations until it's Trump and Amazon.

I like Nicole Wallace and Joe Scarborough.  They are conservative Republicans as are many who are critical of Trump.

I started this thread because many Americans’ lives can change with these tariffs.  My comments on the Depression and it’s relationship to tariffs are noteworthy.  

i

[AztecPadre]

28 minutes ago, Fred said:

Uh, you kow Amazon went years without making a profit and Bezos skated on the benefit of the doubt don't you?  I'm not saying Tump is right on the tariffs, I'm just saying that Amazon and Bezos are exceeding lucky to have made it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonmarkman/2017/05/23/the-amazon-era-no-profits-no-problem/#490ea094437a

Oh but the way, Amazon made $5.7 billion in profit last year.  Guess how much income tax they paid?  $0, zero, zip, nada.  They stand to make an additional $789 million from the new tax breaks.  Bezos' strategy has been to aggressively avoid paying taxes.

https://newrepublic.com/article/147249/amazon-big-tax

Before you go all in on Amazon and Bezos you might want to do a little more research.

So you mean kind of like Trump? 

[hardhit1]

5 hours ago, BigDrop said:

Spartanburg has 8,000 jobs in BMW’s largest plant and Mercedes has 4,000 in Alabama.  The Chinese have announced a 50% tariff on all cars made in the U. S.  Both BMW and Mercedes have several models which are only built in the U.S.  There will be other foreign manufacturers who build here that will suffer on what they sell to China.

Tariffs are incredibly risky.  

What Trump is willing to risk is not the same as many others.  The plants I noted above have thousands of others who work for subcontractors .  I have not even mentioned the American auto workers.

Then, of course, there are Wal Mart, Costco, Amazon and others which carry numerous Chinese manufactured goods which Trump will place a tariff on dramatically raising the price to us.  

Tariffs are incredibly risky...and expensive to everyone reading this.

Note the Smoot Hawley Tariff which exacerbated the Great Depression.

And, just announced:  the Ravens have signed RGIII....

I just lost a job to BMW and they stole my design

so F them and meet your next nightmare Johnny Cock..... something.😆

[BigDrop]

I am only using the German manufacturers as an example.  I also know Tuscaloosa and Greenville/Spartanburg from decades of travel.  As for BMW a topic for another time is the E 45 an hour labor for Munich was originally US 30 an hour and (first major expansion) US 19 for the same job.

 

That’s 1/3 of the Munich labor cost which is what allowed for the Spartsnburg’s plant’s expansion.

 

I apologize for my comments but I have a great deal of primary research (close to a Thesis) on the effects of the Depression on my industry and believe that I am knowledgeable about this.

In the 70’s I spent months in the Library of Congress reading paper originals (later stacks in NY, and up the East Coast which lead to primary interviews and publishing what I learned.

 

Trump is posturing with tariffs which once helped enable our entrance into the Depression. Most reading this have no idea what America and much of the world went through 80  years ago.  It was catastrophic for a Generation.

 

For myself reading Trump’s threats take me back to the actual paper/script that I read when working on my Master’s.  I interviewed more than a dozen people who survived this and have tapes of their comments.  Some of what they said is true for today, almost a description of what we are experiencing now.

 

I have no loyalty to BMW or to any politician.  It is a sober experience to read about some of what Trump is willing to say or threaten.

 

He is risking a lot.

[NotBigdaddybloom]

https://apple.news/Atb2bSTfNQMi-5hDe1XLkgw

[BigDrop]

The link above notes the reaction of the stock market today.  Almost 500 points down (Dow peaked at 26,600 and is down ten per cent) at 9:30 Kudlow’s comments eased concern that the tariffs were only a threat.  The market swung 700 points over the course of the day.

FWIW, in my industry there were more than 30 major rollercoasters built in 1928 (the peak).  There were more than 1,500 amusement parks around the U. S. that year, too.

In 1931 there was one coaster built and it may have been to replace one in an “insurance fire.”  The 1,500 Park figure shrunk to a fraction (3 or 400) by ‘34.  I do not believe there was a single major ride built in the United States in ‘32-‘34.  When manufacturers once again tried (for the few who survived) it was at a fraction of the late ‘20’s selling price.

Again tariffs played s major role in what started this.

 

[Bormio]

The Chinese have been running roughshod over us for years.  They sell a helluva more here than we do there.  They have a lot more to lose.  And economic prosperity is likely propping up their political system as well - the Chinese leadership can not afford a significant downturn.

[BigDrop]

24 minutes ago, Bormio said:

The Chinese have been running roughshod over us for years.  They sell a helluva more here than we do there.  They have a lot more to lose.  And economic prosperity is likely propping up their political system as well - the Chinese leadership can not afford a significant downturn.

China has long been restrictive in what they would allow from a manufacturer.  Simply the majority of a structure/product had to be built or assembled in China.  Thecountry’s explosive growth allowed them to get away with this.  They also stole and copied from everyone else.

 

Today their labor has gone up.  Malaysia, India, the Philippines, etc. are a threat to them because of this.  And, as China’s quality improved with experience so have the others.

 

The problem is that much of American built is more expensive to Americans.  Exceptions like the auto plants I mentioned above are where beginning labor is $19 or 20 an hour-not the Union wages another generation knew.  There are also limitations on where these factories can be located.

Trump used Chinese steel in his Vegas tower.  His family’s products are manufactured offshore.  A lot of his domestic labor is not “native born American.”

There is a reason for all of this:  cost.

The same reason that we have been spoiled at Costco, Walmart and Amazon and where most of their goods are made.

Automation and robotics also factor into this.  They can be a compensating factor for labor.  And eliminate a lot of jobs while keeping the labor cost down.

[Fred]

3 hours ago, AztecPadre said:

So you mean kind of like Trump? 

Clear you didn't read the articles.  Didn't really expect you  to.  Trump doesn't hold a candle to what Amazon is doing.  People would be hollering if they knew the extent.

Again, don't take my points as supporting Trump and the tariffs.  I'm only pointing out that your example is far from as accurate as you would like to believe.  Your "real billionaire" and "great businessman" has used the exact same tactics but in a way that impacts you far more than Trump ever thought about.

[Fred]

3 hours ago, Columbiafan said:

I like Amazon

They have stuff that retail stores won't sell anymore and generally whenever i go to somewhere like Walmart i get sent in circles for 30 minutes only to find out it's out of stock

Then i can go on amazon and find it for cheaper and not go through the hassle

Amazon is a consumer dream

Think they are a consumer dream?  Research how they treat their vendors and the people that set up shop through Amazon fulfillment services.  Don;t like losing choices in stores at the local level?  Many people think Walmart is evil incarnate but don't blink an eye at using on-line services.  Those on-line services are running local stores and even large national chains out of business right and left.  The tax issue impacts you daily without you even realizing it.

There are two sides to every transaction - the customer side and the vendor side.  As Amazon continues to kill the small vendor side, your choices dwindle.  I know you are just out of high school but hopefully you had some economics classes.  A monopoly or close to it is *not* good for the consumer as the monopoly will act only in its best interest over time.  Sure there will be some act of charity but that is to keep the well primed so to speak.  The beauty of the free market is that choices tend to control pricing.  When the choices decrease the price moves at the whim of the supplier.

Anyway, this is getting far too deep for a football message board.  Enjoy your evening.

[DevilDog]

8 hours ago, AztecPadre said:

Yeah this kat does not care about anybody except trump. He's only after Amazon out of pure jealousy. The founder is not only a real billionaire unlike him. But is also a great business man. Unlike him. He's pissed also because he thinks he's the only one who should be making "great" deals. Piece of mierda.  

He has a plan once all the immigrants are gone all those auto workers got ready made service industry jobs.  This guy is Brilliant.  He will just tell Cooter they Took his Job!

 

[GloryDays]

4 hours ago, Fred said:

Uh, you kow Amazon went years without making a profit and Bezos skated on the benefit of the doubt don't you?  I'm not saying Tump is right on the tariffs, I'm just saying that Amazon and Bezos are exceeding lucky to have made it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonmarkman/2017/05/23/the-amazon-era-no-profits-no-problem/#490ea094437a

Oh but the way, Amazon made $5.7 billion in profit last year.  Guess how much income tax they paid?  $0, zero, zip, nada.  They stand to make an additional $789 million from the new tax breaks.  Bezos' strategy has been to aggressively avoid paying taxes.

https://newrepublic.com/article/147249/amazon-big-tax

Before you go all in on Amazon and Bezos you might want to do a little more research.

I'm all for ending corporate welfare in general.  

 

Specifically targeting Amazon is silly, and unfortunately looks shitty for Trump.

[BigDrop]

Trump is now posturing $100 billion in tariffs with the result that Dow futures are down 300 and falling (again) at 10:00pm Thursday.

Upthread I note the effect of tariffs and the Depression of 1930+.  Regardless of what one thinks of Trump he is playing with our money, with pension funds, IRA’s and a foundation that most reading this are probably unwilling to risk.

But he is doing it once again.

Insanely irresponsible.  FWIW I have 95% of our savings in bonds and fixed income.  Other than VWINX (60% fixed income 40% dividend paying large cap stock) I am out of the market.  This is no longer political-it is about risking what one might have spent a literal lifetime saving.

Even Kudlow is against tariffs.  He knows what Trump is risking, threatening all of us.

 

[Mjd33]

23 hours ago, Fred said:

hopefully you had some economics classes. 

I don’t think he has an MBA from wharton let’s put it that way. 

[Mjd33]

On 4/4/2018 at 7:35 PM, AztecPadre said:

So you mean kind of like Trump? 

Comparing Trump to Amazon in regard to taxes? You’re joking right. 

[Mjd33]

On 4/4/2018 at 7:16 PM, Columbiafan said:

Amazon is a consumer dream

Only Micro viewpoint .... Macro?.... poor take. 

[Columbiafan]

38 minutes ago, Mjd33 said:

Comparing Trump to Amazon in regard to taxes? You’re joking right. 

Why? 

 

It's ok for Trump to skip out on taxes and be considered a "perfect American" but someone else does it and they are thugs?