Former President Donald Trump Indicted in New York

[GoBigBlack]

1 hour ago, Warrior said:

Since Trump did not violate any federal election campaign law, Bragg trying to say he manipulated business records to cover up a crime that was never a crime, is total nonsense. The indictment should be thrown out with prejudice and Bragg face disciplinary action. Never mind- you’ll choose what you want to believe.

Where’d you get your law degree from again?

[Warrior]

3 hours ago, GoBigBlack said:

Where’d you get your law degree from again?

I didn’t, I do enjoy listening to legal experts. You may want to give it a shot.

[DBP66]

6 hours ago, Warrior said:

Since Trump did not violate any federal election campaign law, Bragg trying to say he manipulated business records to cover up a crime that was never a crime, is total nonsense. The indictment should be thrown out with prejudice and Bragg face disciplinary action. Never mind- you’ll choose what you want to believe.

and how about the grand jury that charged Trump?....should we go after them too??.....🤡

[Warrior]

1 hour ago, DBP66 said:

and how about the grand jury that charged Trump?....should we go after them too??.....🤡

Grand Jurys are a one sided affair - a DA with an agenda waves a powerful stick especially in NY. Practically a layup. 

Rut Ro....

A key member of the Federal Election Commission today rejected the Manhattan district attorney’s indictment of former President Donald Trump as a violation of federal election laws.

“It's not a campaign finance violation. It's not a reporting violation of any kind,” said FEC Commissioner 

In trying to stretch the law to make it look like a violation, he added, District Attorney Alvin Bragg “is really trying to make a square peg fit into a round hole.”

In a 34-count indictment of Trump, the first criminal case ever against a former president, Bragg charged that a $130,000 payment made by former Trump lawyer Michael Cohen to porn star Stormy Daniels, which Cohen went to jail for in a plea deal, violated several campaign finance laws that splashed onto Trump.

But, said Trainor, the FEC and Justice Department already considered the case and tossed it.

Thanks for playing and goodnight. 

[DBP66]

6 hours ago, Warrior said:

Grand Jurys are a one sided affair - a DA with an agenda waves a powerful stick especially in NY. Practically a layup. 

Rut Ro....

A key member of the Federal Election Commission today rejected the Manhattan district attorney’s indictment of former President Donald Trump as a violation of federal election laws.

“It's not a campaign finance violation. It's not a reporting violation of any kind,” said FEC Commissioner 

In trying to stretch the law to make it look like a violation, he added, District Attorney Alvin Bragg “is really trying to make a square peg fit into a round hole.”

In a 34-count indictment of Trump, the first criminal case ever against a former president, Bragg charged that a $130,000 payment made by former Trump lawyer Michael Cohen to porn star Stormy Daniels, which Cohen went to jail for in a plea deal, violated several campaign finance laws that splashed onto Trump.

But, said Trainor, the FEC and Justice Department already considered the case and tossed it.

Thanks for playing and goodnight. 

too bad the tax issue is a state tax issue.....you're welcome!

[Warrior]

2 hours ago, DBP66 said:

too bad the the tax issue is a state tax issue.....you're welcome!

Hang in there DP, one day your dream may come true. But not this time. 

[GoBigBlack]

4 minutes ago, Warrior said:

Hang in there DP, one day your dream may come true. But not this time. 

What legal expert told you that?

[Warrior]

2 hours ago, GoBigBlack said:

What legal expert told you that?

About 95% of the ones I've read - many not Trump fans. And the FEC commissioner.  Which have you read that have said the opposite?

[Warrior]

Mark Bederow, a criminal defense attorney and former prosecutor for the Manhattan district attorney's office, told Insider he was underwhelmed by the charging document, calling it "strikingly empty with respect to what crime was being concealed to make what is obviously a time-barred misdemeanor into a felony."

[Warrior]

Ambrosio Rodriguez, a former prosecutor in the Riverside County district attorney's office in Southern California, echoed that view.

"The reality is, these facts are pretty stale," he said of the indictment. "We've known about this since what – 2018? Both Karen McDougal and Stormy Daniels have been interviewed a million times."

"They told their story and there are no surprises here," he added.

 

 

[GoBigBlack]

6 minutes ago, Warrior said:

About 95% of the ones I've ready - many not Trump fans. And the FEC commissioner.  Which have you read that have said the opposite?

The FEC commissioner who campaigned for Trump, worked for the RNC, and was then appointed by Trump after he was elected? Yes or no?

[Warrior]

In a Tuesday opinion piece for The New York Times, Eisen and Karen Friedman Agnifilo, a former Manhattan chief assistant district attorney, argued that Bragg's case was strong, citing similar cases prosecuted in New York.

But the cases cited in the New York Time's op-ed and Just Security all show clear intent to defraud. Randall Eliason, a law professor at George Washington University, previously noted that prosecutors could face an additional wrinkle where Trump is concerned.

New York's business records statute's "intent to defraud" requirement is "usually defined as intent to deprive a victim of money or property," Eliason wrote, and "it's not clear how concealing a campaign contribution does."

[Warrior]

Another "Legal Expert's" opinion for you since your were concerned.

Jeremy Saland, a criminal defense attorney who previously worked as a Manhattan prosecutor, told Insider that you typically "don't see an indictment solely of falsifying business records." He also questioned why Bragg's office elected not to include the other alleged crimes in the indictment, even if that's not legally required.

 

[Warrior]

Joshua Ritter, a former Los Angeles County prosecutor and partner with El Dabe Ritter Trial Lawyers, told Insider he thought prosecutors may have "overcharged" by bringing 34 counts, and that it could help Trump in the eyes of the public by giving the appearance of "piling on."

He also thought Bragg was too dismissive about not disclosing what the alleged underlying crimes were. "If they fall apart then the whole indictment falls apart," he said.

[Warrior]

36 minutes ago, GoBigBlack said:

The FEC commissioner who campaigned for Trump, worked for the RNC, and was then appointed by Trump after he was elected? Yes or no?

FEC Commissioner, independent agency responsible for administering and enforcing laws that cover federal election campaigns. The FEC oversees the public financing of presidential elections, ensures public disclosure of campaign finance activities, monitors campaign contributions and expenditures, regulates the campaign activities of political action committees (PACs), and investigates reports of violations. It is composed of six commissioners appointed by the president with the advice and consent of the Senate.

Think he knows what he's talking about more then Bragg - but probably not close to your wealth of knowledge. 

[GoBigBlack]

12 minutes ago, Warrior said:

FEC Commissioner, independent agency responsible for administering and enforcing laws that cover federal election campaigns. The FEC oversees the public financing of presidential elections, ensures public disclosure of campaign finance activities, monitors campaign contributions and expenditures, regulates the campaign activities of political action committees (PACs), and investigates reports of violations. It is composed of six commissioners appointed by the president with the advice and consent of the Senate.

Think he knows what he's talking about more then Bragg - but probably not close to your wealth of knowledge. 

I suppose you’re going to give the opinions of the other FEC commissioners with equal weight then, right?

[15yds4gibberish]

Nobody asked, but here’s my hot take (you get what you pay for).  The commentary about the Manhattan indictment/statement runs the spectrum between weak and strong.  An attorney friend pointed this out:  As a general rule, former fed prosecutors and law professors tend to think it’s weaker.  Those who practiced NY State criminal law tend to think it is stronger.

My current hot take is this*:  Would like to know more, but it will unfold in due time and I can wait. Meanwhile it’s not apparent to me how much it will matter.  Manhattan isn’t former guy's most significant legal problem.  Within 6 months, there’s a very good chance the former guy could be looking at up to four separate indictments. An indictment in Fulton County appears likely. The DOJ investigations led by Jack Smith appear both to have the most significant downside and to be proceeding very quickly (another significant obstruction ruling today - may go to Supreme Court).

I’m guessing none of these cases go to trial before the election -- unless the defendant invokes his speedy trial rights – which he isn’t likely to do.  If he hasn’t gone to trial, but wins the election, we would be looking at a constitutional crisis.

* As always, I reserve the right to change my mind as new information becomes available.

[golfaddict1]

1 minute ago, 15yds4gibberish said:

Nobody asked, but here’s my hot take (you get what you pay for).  The commentary about the Manhattan indictment/statement runs the spectrum between weak and strong.  An attorney friend pointed this out:  As a general rule, former fed prosecutors and law professors tend to think it’s weaker.  Those who practiced NY State criminal law tend to think it is stronger.

My current hot take is this*:  Would like to know more, but it will unfold in due time and I can wait. Meanwhile it’s not apparent to me how much it will matter.  Manhattan isn’t former guy's most significant legal problem.  Within 6 months, there’s a very good chance the former guy could be looking at up to four separate indictments. An indictment in Fulton County appears likely. The DOJ investigations led by Jack Smith appear both to have the most significant downside and to be proceeding very quickly (another significant obstruction ruling today - may go to Supreme Court).

I’m guessing none of these cases go to trial before the election -- unless the defendant invokes his speedy trial rights – which he isn’t likely to do.  If he hasn’t gone to trial, but wins the election, we would be looking at a constitutional crisis.

* As always, I reserve the right to change my mind as new information becomes available.

15, Jack Smith is a good follow on Twitter fyi.  @DBP66@I AM IRONMAN, no, not Jackie Smith.  😉 (like Buckner, solid player but one memory ouch). 

[Warrior]

33 minutes ago, GoBigBlack said:

I suppose you’re going to give the opinions of the other FEC commissioners with equal weight then, right?

As you would give Bragg the even handed DA.

[World Citizen]

6 minutes ago, 15yds4gibberish said:

Nobody asked, but here’s my hot take (you get what you pay for).  The commentary about the Manhattan indictment/statement runs the spectrum between weak and strong.  An attorney friend pointed this out:  As a general rule, former fed prosecutors and law professors tend to think it’s weaker.  Those who practiced NY State criminal law tend to think it is stronger.

My current hot take is this*:  Would like to know more, but it will unfold in due time and I can wait. Meanwhile it’s not apparent to me how much it will matter.  Manhattan isn’t former guy's most significant legal problem.  Within 6 months, there’s a very good chance the former guy could be looking at up to four separate indictments. An indictment in Fulton County appears likely. The DOJ investigations led by Jack Smith appear both to have the most significant downside and to be proceeding very quickly (another significant obstruction ruling today - may go to Supreme Court).

I’m guessing none of these cases go to trial before the election -- unless the defendant invokes his speedy trial rights – which he isn’t likely to do.  If he hasn’t gone to trial, but wins the election, we would be looking at a constitutional crisis.

* As always, I reserve the right to change my mind as new information becomes available.

Karma will undoubtably deal with Trump as it does with everybody and that is why whatever happens I will be ok.  It would be nice to witness him in a orange jump suit sitting behind bars because that is where he belongs.  Either way, the cult will still be here and still be battling reality.  It is like MAGA is an entirely different species.  Like they split off from homo sapiens in 2016.  The deplorables are indeed deplorable.  

[Nolebull813]

6 minutes ago, World Citizen said:

Karma will undoubtably deal with Trump as it does with everybody and that is why whatever happens I will be ok.  It would be nice to witness him in an orange jump suit sitting behind bars because that is where he belongs.  Either way, the cult will still be here and still be battling reality.  It is like MAGA is an entirely different species.  Like they split off from homo sapiens in 2016.  The deplorables are indeed deplorable.  

Whoever runs your account must use ChatGBT to auto fill in some fucking stupid take that’s the opposite of reality. 
 

You criticize “MAGA” people but are oddly silent about all the left-wing terrorism that has been plaguing the country. 
 

you must be a hypocrite-bot

[DBP66]

46 minutes ago, golfaddict1 said:

15, Jack Smith is a good follow on Twitter fyi.  @DBP66@I AM IRONMAN, no, not Jackie Smith.  😉 (like Buckner, solid player but one memory ouch). 

you ain't kidding....another BAD 70's Cowboy memory?....when we had the Steelers 3rd and long deep on their side of the field and Benny Barns is covering Lynn Swann....he runs a go pattern....they are running side by side....they get their feet tangled...and they threw a flag!!..you know how the story ended.

they ended up changing the rule when the D.B.'s and W.R.'s inadvertently tangle their feet so it's not pass interference anymore...still pisses me off!!...😉

[golfaddict1]

4 minutes ago, DBP66 said:

you ain't kidding....another BAD 70's Cowboy memory?....when we had the Steelers 3rd and long deep on their side of the field and Benny Barns is covering Lynn Swann....he runs a go pattern....they are running side by side....they get their feet tangled...and they threw a flag!!..you know how the story ended.

they ended up changing the rule when the D.B.'s and W.R.'s inadvertently tangle their feet so it's not pass interference anymore...still pisses me off!!...😉

Yep, as sports fanatics each of us has our “Jackie Smith”.  

Csonka in huddle repeating “don’t give me the ball” or similar.  Pisarcik to Csonka handoff = Miracle at the Meadowlands (Herm Edwards) 

Another Eagles special… Desaun Jackson punt return for TD 

Vs San Fran playoffs, botched snap (veteran LS specialist signed that year I believe) on game winning attempt 

vs Rams 

Not a F-up, but I felt like adding a play that’s high on my Giants misery index.  

Flipper Anderson scores, Rams win, Flipper leaves the building and Giants schedule golf/hunting/fishing trips. 
 

Click on Watch on You Tube link at bottom.  

[DBP66]

10 minutes ago, golfaddict1 said:

Yep, as sports fanatics each of us has our “Jackie Smith”.  

Csonka in huddle repeating “don’t give me the ball” or similar.  Pisarcik to Csonka handoff = Miracle at the Meadowlands (Herm Edwards) 

Another Eagles special… Desaun Jackson punt return for TD 

Vs San Fran playoffs, botched snap (veteran LS specialist signed that year I believe) on game winning attempt 

vs Rams 

Not a F-up, but I felt like adding a play that’s high on my Giants misery index.  

Flipper Anderson scores, Rams win, Flipper leaves the building and Giants schedule golf/hunting/fishing trips. 
 

Click on Watch on You Tube link at bottom.  

I remember the Jackson punt return and the Joe P. fumble....and Jackson was a wise ass which made it even worse!...

I was at a game at the Meadowlands a few years ago when Cole Beasley caught a T.D. pass on one knee in the last minute of the game.....awesome win for me and watching Giants fans lose their minds that day was great memory. Sorry to say...😉

[golfaddict1]

25 minutes ago, DBP66 said:

I remember the Jackson punt return and the Joe P. fumble....and Jackson was a wise ass which made it even worse!...

I was at a game at the Meadowlands a few years ago when Cole Beasley caught a T.D. pass on one knee in the last minute of the game.....awesome win for me and watching Giants fans lose their minds that day was great memory. Sorry to say...😉

Yea, Jackson was a hot dog.  He also had tremendous acceleration, which burned the Giants multiple times.  

When my Dad used to show me his annual selection of 4 home games I think it was from his workplace, I was always psyched when I saw Dallas of course.  Washington also was a hell yea.  

Like the Giants mention above, Dallas also had a muffed FG attempt (vs Seattle). Don’t recall the time of game left, but Romo miscued a snap.  
 

I hope Tyreek Hill wasn’t serious about retiring after the ‘23 season.  I just saw a headline last night, but didn’t read any article with details. Edit:  ‘25 season.  That’s better!  3 more years of world class track speed on the gridiron.