steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 4 minutes ago, Cossacks said: I will say not many in the equalizer proving ground ie. The NFL. Exactly, Harbaugh has a much better resume. Won the only outright NC at Michigan in modern day football. Without having a stacked roster that nobody could compete with. Turned Stanford into a top 10 team Had NFL success leading the niners to the super bowl Winning two PFL Championships at the University of San Diego 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pied Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 1 hour ago, steeler01 said: To me getting all the top talent and bullying less talented teams isn't being this great coach. College football isn't about being the best coach, 80 percent of it is about being the best car salesman to get the talent. I hear what you're saying but the argument falls short to me for a fe reasons. A big part of coaching in college and the pros is roster management(and certain high schools :)). It's done differently in both leagues but in college the HC has much more of a role. There is no one that got the talent and in the right spots more than him. As others have noted, there have been some very talented teams and he's been able to beat them. Coaching and managing high level athletes has not proven to be easy. All start teams throughout history have underperformed. Pep Guardiola is one that is another master at it. Just having more talent isn't enough. You brought up his record against Georgia was 3-1 and could have been 2-2 with one OT victory. He lost the semifinal this year in OT, 3 yards and a 2 point conversion. If they get that, they are favorites over Washignton or TRexas and he likely has his eighth title. Saban = GOAT and I'm not too upset that he's leaving now that we're joining the SEC. That is unless they target Sark lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMaximumHornetSting Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 57 minutes ago, ChimpGrip said: We’ve had some of the best recruiting classes and have fallen just short in 2021 and 2023 at winning it all. He’s the best coach ever. Get over it. Plus he’s 72. Woah there nelly... He'll be remembered as one of the best to ever coach the sport on the collegiate level but best EVER.... Idk bout that... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, pied said: A big part of coaching in college and the pros is roster management(and certain high schools :)). It's done differently in both leagues but in college the HC has much more of a role. There is no one that got the talent and in the right spots more than him. Roster management isn't equal in college football. A school like Boise State will never be able to stack a roster like Alabama or Georgia. I liken it to HS football. Better coach to you... whoever coaches IMG or Riley Dodge? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 4 minutes ago, pied said: I hear what you're saying but the argument falls short to me for a fe reasons. A big part of coaching in college and the pros is roster management(and certain high schools :)). It's done differently in both leagues but in college the HC has much more of a role. There is no one that got the talent and in the right spots more than him. As others have noted, there have been some very talented teams and he's been able to beat them. Coaching and managing high level athletes has not proven to be easy. All start teams throughout history have underperformed. Pep Guardiola is one that is another master at it. Just having more talent isn't enough. You brought up his record against Georgia was 3-1 and could have been 2-2 with one OT victory. He lost the semifinal this year in OT, 3 yards and a 2 point conversion. If they get that, they are favorites over Washignton or TRexas and he likely has his eighth title. Saban = GOAT and I'm not too upset that he's leaving now that we're joining the SEC. That is unless they target Sark lol It is 5-1 vs Kirby and Saban beat Mark Richt a few times. Saban beating Kirby and Richt except 1 game were played in Georgia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliNorth Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 16 minutes ago, steeler01 said: That's a great question, and I'd have to dig into that. I can honestly say I think much more of Harbaugh as a coach than Saban. Harbaugh has his strengths, along with his weak points. I think he is good at building a team, but his offensive philosophy leaves a lot to be desired. Way too conservative . Plays for fgs, trying to hold on to leads, rather than just bury a team. He did a great job of getting Stanford relevant and up to speed, but he always failed in the big games up until now. He had the niners get right to the precipice 3 years in a row, only to lose. We used to always gripe how conservative he was, seemingly playing not to lose rather than to win. Maybe he would be better now in NFL, but will have to wait on that one . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 2 minutes ago, steeler01 said: Roster management isn't equal in college football. A school like Boise State will never be able to stack a roster like Alabama or Georgia. I liken it to HS football. Better coach to you... whoever coaches IMG or Riley Dodge? SLC was recruiting like hell then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, CaliNorth said: Harbaugh has his strengths, along with his weak points. I think he is good at building a team, but his offensive philosophy leaves a lot to be desired. Way too conservative . Plays for fgs, trying to hold on to leads, rather than just bury a team. He did a great job of getting Stanford relevant and up to speed, but he always failed in the big games up until now. He had the niners get right to the precipice 3 years in a row, only to lose. We used to always gripe how conservative he was, seemingly playing not to lose rather than to win. Maybe he would be better now in NFL, but will have to wait on that one . The teams he built, weren't built with top 3 recruiting classes at powerhouse programs. It would be unfair to give him the Alabama 2015-2018 rosters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 28 minutes ago, HooverOutlaw said: Saban did not make Alabama it was already the best program in history. Like already said Saban did this when the SEC was the top conference by miles. Take away Saban's wins and other than the Bryan years, Alabama has been average. And yes, I realize you cannot just take away those years but to claim Alabama is the best program in history before Saban is homerism at its best ... or worst. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, HooverOutlaw said: SLC was recruiting like hell then. Riley Dodge hasn't won a championship Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 2 minutes ago, CaliNorth said: Harbaugh has his strengths, along with his weak points. I think he is good at building a team, but his offensive philosophy leaves a lot to be desired. Way too conservative . Plays for fgs, trying to hold on to leads, rather than just bury a team. He did a great job of getting Stanford relevant and up to speed, but he always failed in the big games up until now. He had the niners get right to the precipice 3 years in a row, only to lose. We used to always gripe how conservative he was, seemingly playing not to lose rather than to win. Maybe he would be better now in NFL, but will have to wait on that one . How do you consider a guy who has a losing record to his biggest rival in Ohio State an elite coach. Should be 1 more loss but Michigan backed out of that game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, HooverOutlaw said: How do you consider a guy who has a losing record to his biggest rival in Ohio State an elite coach. Should be 1 more loss but Michigan backed out of that game. How do you consider a guy when talent is equal to be a losing coach great(NFL) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 1 minute ago, Fred said: Take away Saban's wins and other than the Bryan years, Alabama has been average. And yes, I realize you cannot just take away those years but to claim Alabama is the best program in history before Saban is homerism at its best ... or worst. Alabama won national titles in the 1920s and 1930s and 1992 with Bryant or Saban 42 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pied Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 4 minutes ago, steeler01 said: Roster management isn't equal in college football. A school like Boise State will never be able to stack a roster like Alabama or Georgia. I liken it to HS football. Better coach to you... whoever coaches IMG or Riley Dodge? No it is not, but Alabama (before Saban) was much different than USC/ND/Miami/Florida/Florida State/Tennessee/LSU/Georgia/ou/etc...... None of those programs(or any opther) have done what Nick Saban has. Riley Dodge and whoever coaches IMG don't coach with the same rules or the same goals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Let's be honest Kelly vs Alabama in the NC game. What could Kelly have done to make the game competitive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, steeler01 said: How do you consider a guy when talent is equal to be a losing coach great? 1 game does not change a history. Like I said Frazier beat Ali once. But history shows Ali was better. Question is why did Harbaugh not recruit better like Alabama Georgia or Ohio State. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 1 minute ago, pied said: No it is not, but Alabama (before Saban) was much different than USC/ND/Miami/Florida/Florida State/Tennessee/LSU/Georgia/ou/etc...... None of those programs(or any opther) have done what Nick Saban has. Riley Dodge and whoever coaches IMG don't coach with the same rules or the same goals. But guess what Bryant did it at Alabama before Saban. The key is Alabama. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pied Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 3 minutes ago, HooverOutlaw said: SLC was recruiting like hell then. They were certainly attracting recruits during their run. 3 minutes ago, steeler01 said: Riley Dodge hasn't won a championship Southlake has a couple of things hindering them imo. There is not much affordable housing if someone was looking to move (zero apartments in the school district) and their recent stance on social/political issues has an effect on attractiveness to minorities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, pied said: Riley Dodge and whoever coaches IMG don't coach with the same rules or the same goals. They coach to win every game they play right? Does every program in college football have the same chance to recruit elite classes? The only difference is one roster is much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 1 minute ago, steeler01 said: Let's be honest Kelly vs Alabama in the NC game. What could Kelly have done to make the game competitive? Recruit better. According to Notre Dame their brand sells players. In the 2 games vs Alabama Notre Dame got hammered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChimpGrip Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 13 minutes ago, TheMaximumHornetSting said: Woah there nelly... He'll be remembered as one of the best to ever coach the sport on the collegiate level but best EVER.... Idk bout that... That’s what meant. Was hoping it was easy to deduce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 2 minutes ago, HooverOutlaw said: 1 game does not change a history. Like I said Frazier beat Ali once. But history shows Ali was better. Question is why did Harbaugh not recruit better like Alabama Georgia or Ohio State. Not one game. Saban coached in the NFL. He wasn't able to bully teams all game long and ran. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steeler01 Posted January 11 Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, HooverOutlaw said: Recruit better. According to Notre Dame their brand sells players. In the 2 games vs Alabama Notre Dame got hammered. So then that's not coaching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 3 minutes ago, pied said: They were certainly attracting recruits during their run. Southlake has a couple of things hindering them imo. There is not much affordable housing if someone was looking to move (zero apartments in the school district) and their recent stance on social/political issues has an effect on attractiveness to minorities. I think Dodge got busted for roids in college I might be wrong on this . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HooverOutlaw Posted January 11 Author Report Share Posted January 11 Just now, steeler01 said: Not one game. Saban coached in the NFL. He wasn't able to bully teams all game long and ran. 2 years does not define him as a bad NFL coach. I think if he was allowed to get Drew Brees he never comes to Alabama. He wanted total control Alabama gave him that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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