Publics vs Privates

[Wooderson]

On 5/7/2018 at 10:38 AM, golfaddict1 said:

 

Look at Higley's roster; they have designs on playing 120-pounders on varsity and all of five kids over 250 on their roster. Yeah they got some transfers, headed by a quarterback that's perfectly fine with being a backup for a 5A school  (after starting a frosh and soph at a perennial 6A power) and a bunch of kids that were not relevant to the programs they left. There's also the small detail that Higley's never won a damn thing. Reality is they are the third best team in their league (not in 5A but their local division) behind Williams Field  (three-year starter at QB, national level recruit at WR/S, and an experienced defense), and Casteel (jumping from 3A to 5A after recording a state championship season without a senior class).

Centennial had a 1400-yard rusher transfer in from North Vegas as well as a pair of 6-2 junior-to-be receivers from Southwest suburbs. Difference is Centennial's staff has better things to do than notify the local fish wrap on the matter.

[golfaddict1]

14 hours ago, Wooderson said:

Look at Higley's roster; they have designs on playing 120-pounders on varsity and all of five kids over 250 on their roster. Yeah they got some transfers, headed by a quarterback that's perfectly fine with being a backup for a 5A school  (after starting a frosh and soph at a perennial 6A power) and a bunch of kids that were not relevant to the programs they left. There's also the small detail that Higley's never won a damn thing. Reality is they are the third best team in their league (not in 5A but their local division) behind Williams Field  (three-year starter at QB, national level recruit at WR/S, and an experienced defense), and Casteel (jumping from 3A to 5A after recording a state championship season without a senior class).

Centennial had a 1400-yard rusher transfer in from North Vegas as well as a pair of 6-2 junior-to-be receivers from Southwest suburbs. Difference is Centennial's staff has better things to do than notify the local fish wrap on the matter.

You forgot to mention they almost took out Saguaro in the semis last year 37-31 OT   

Obert did an article on Saguaro's recruits I noticed also... no surprise they are LOADED (many power 5 offered kids).  It is odd seeing them in 4A and Higley just moved up.  

Someone likes Higley early 2018... and his name is Ned Freeman.    You must dig his AZ algorithm ratings like reading Obert columns.  You can find all kinds of fun AZ stuff, even best single year category on this novelty tool site.   Calpreps.com 

Here's his early 5A look... not sure it's going to change much before August official preseason list.  I see some schools have added their roster info  (team preview).   The team preview is a nice look to see returning starters and key returnees.    They may not have all accurate info listed however.   Don't freak too much as it's an algorithm and needs some data to start somewhere and roster makeup w favoring recruit numbers is favored over previous results.   Once the games start to be played the #'s will adjust.  

 

[Wooderson]

7 hours ago, golfaddict1 said:

You forgot to mention they almost took out Saguaro in the semis last year 37-31 OT   

Obert did an article on Saguaro's recruits I noticed also... no surprise they are LOADED (many power 5 offered kids).  It is odd seeing them in 4A and Higley just moved up.  

Someone likes Higley early 2018... and his name is Ned Freeman.    You must dig his AZ algorithm ratings like reading Obert columns.  You can find all kinds of fun AZ stuff, even best single year category on this novelty tool site.   Calpreps.com 

Here's his early 5A look... not sure it's going to change much before August official preseason list.  I see some schools have added their roster info  (team preview).   The team preview is a nice look to see returning starters and key returnees.    They may not have all accurate info listed however.   Don't freak too much as it's an algorithm and needs some data to start somewhere and roster makeup w favoring recruit numbers is favored over previous results.   Once the games start to be played the #'s will adjust.  

 

I didn't mention the Saguaro game because it's not worth mentioning; losing a close game to Arizona's eighth-best team isn't an accomplishment and frankly backs up my point in spades.  Higley doesn't have any wins of note on their resume, but wouldn't ya know the fifth time they play Saguaro since both head coaches have been at their respective schools they managed to play Saguaro to a close game (previous four games were Saguaro wins decided by an average of over 36 points a game).  If the best thing that can be said about Higley is they almost beat Saguaro that pretty perfectly illustrates that Higley has a ways to go before they're ready for prime-time.  What's hysterical is Higley gets hyped when they're not even the best team jumping up to 5A that gave Saguaro a scare last year--Sunrise Mountain returns a 2900-yard passer, three of their top four rushers, and two 500-yard receivers after an 11-2 season where they fell to Saguaro 24-21.  Higley returns a 1900-yard passer (who also happens to be their leading returning rusher), even with transfers doesn't have anyone with more than 350 receiving yards coming back, but gets hype because 1) Obert's smitten with their coach because he played at DLS; and 2) they have two tall guys playing d-end.  Only thing Obert got right in that article is that anyone with 5A title aspirations is going to have to get through Centennial to do so.  

As for Freeman/CalPreps, I find the chart you present rather odd when I get different information from their actual preview page; they don't have the team-by-team comparisons, but it does have it to wear you can click through each state's rankings team-by-team (they have Arizona's top ten as Chandler-Pinnacle-Perry-Mountain Pointe-Saguaro-Desert Ridge-Queen Creek-Centennial [with a starting power ranking of 38.6], Highland, then Higley [35.1]).  Not that it matters, because computer rankings are absolute shit no matter how you slice it.

[golfaddict1]

43 minutes ago, Wooderson said:

I didn't mention the Saguaro game because it's not worth mentioning; losing a close game to Arizona's eighth-best team isn't an accomplishment and frankly backs up my point in spades.  Higley doesn't have any wins of note on their resume, but wouldn't ya know the fifth time they play Saguaro since both head coaches have been at their respective schools they managed to play Saguaro to a close game (previous four games were Saguaro wins decided by an average of over 36 points a game).  If the best thing that can be said about Higley is they almost beat Saguaro that pretty perfectly illustrates that Higley has a ways to go before they're ready for prime-time.  What's hysterical is Higley gets hyped when they're not even the best team jumping up to 5A that gave Saguaro a scare last year--Sunrise Mountain returns a 2900-yard passer, three of their top four rushers, and two 500-yard receivers after an 11-2 season where they fell to Saguaro 24-21.  Higley returns a 1900-yard passer (who also happens to be their leading returning rusher), even with transfers doesn't have anyone with more than 350 receiving yards coming back, but gets hype because 1) Obert's smitten with their coach because he played at DLS; and 2) they have two tall guys playing d-end.  Only thing Obert got right in that article is that anyone with 5A title aspirations is going to have to get through Centennial to do so.  

As for Freeman/CalPreps, I find the chart you present rather odd when I get different information from their actual preview page; they don't have the team-by-team comparisons, but it does have it to wear you can click through each state's rankings team-by-team (they have Arizona's top ten as Chandler-Pinnacle-Perry-Mountain Pointe-Saguaro-Desert Ridge-Queen Creek-Centennial [with a starting power ranking of 38.6], Highland, then Higley [35.1]).  Not that it matters, because computer rankings are absolute shit no matter how you slice it.

I didn’t realize only credible teams get articles... ?  

I admire your fanaticism but how Higley has done in the past however many years is irrelevant to this article.  It’s about 2018 and they lost in the semis in OT to a 4A power, moved up a class and have a high number of transfers.   It was an interesting read.   I also learned about an interesting athlete with good size playing DE/TE for Higley.   So thank you Mr Norbert   

You crack me up with info about a school and wanting credit for showing they don’t deserve an article?   Do you want them to fail like Saguaro?     

Who’s placing them number one other than Calpreps perhaps for 5A 2018 to start the year as i showed above.   It’s an article for a state that rarely gets any press here.   Higley isn’t projected to make the Geico series, but maybe they’ll improve from last year.  I won’t lose sleep either way and enjoyed the read.     

 

 

[Wooderson]

1 hour ago, golfaddict1 said:

I didn’t realize only credible teams get articles... ?  

I admire your fanaticism but how Higley has done in the past however many years is irrelevant to this article.  It’s about 2018 and they lost in the semis in OT to a 4A power, moved up a class and have a high number of transfers.   It was an interesting read.   I also learned about an interesting athlete with good size playing DE/TE for Higley.   So thank you Mr Norbert   

You crack me up with info about a school and wanting credit for showing they don’t deserve an article?   Do you want them to fail like Saguaro?     

Who’s placing them number one other than Calpreps perhaps for 5A 2018 to start the year as i showed above.   It’s an article for a state that rarely gets any press here.   Higley isn’t projected to make the Geico series, but maybe they’ll improve from last year.  I won’t lose sleep either way and enjoyed the read.     

 

 

I'm not wired like most of the guys on here-I don't have a great deal of rooting interest in the state of Arizona apart from how those from the westside of Phoenix perform.  Why?  Because what happened in Scottsdale, Chandler, and friggin' Higley had nothing more than a negligible impact on my comings and goings out here.  No I don't want Saguaro to "fail", at the same time if people are going to proclaim them some smashing national success without knowing who Peoria Centennial is (and how they've dealt with Saguaro in intermittent clashes over the past 20+ years) then frankly that declaration of success isn't worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin getting it on.

I've expressed my purpose of being here time and again but I'll say it once more-I really don't care what the national perception of high school football in Arizona is.  That is to say, whether people want to portray Chandler or Saguaro or Mountain Pointe as national-level programs people should go right ahead and do so...as long as the program at Centennial that has accomplished more than two of those schools and has never lost a game to the third is also elevated into that conversation.  At this time that's not happening and about every excuse in the book is thrown out there to justify the slight-first it was their lack of national competition, then they were in over their heads against STA, then when they beat STA it turns STA just wasn't that good or Centennial just didn't look that good.  People are too quick to overlook 15 years of continuous success (including success over the three teams previously mentioned) and a willingness to take on national competition that the likes of Saguaro have never dreamed of playing based on little more than not being another generic, air-it-out spread offense.  If something is worth doing it'sworth doing right-any national conversation that doesn't have Centennial on equal footing with those other schools (in the very least) is simply inept.

Bottom line is I'd rather Arizona go without hype on the national scene to then to have shit like Higley getting hyped-up right before they churn out a 6-4 season (already said they are the third-best team in their section behind Williams Field and Casteel; with games against Paracleet and Moorpark on the agenda along with contests against established larger in-state schools like Horizon, Campo Verde, Marana Mountain View, and Maricopa there's plenty of land mines on their slate).  I'm not a believer in the "no such thing as bad publicity" school of thought; it's concerning to me that the main prep sportswriter in Arizona is wasting his time in the middle of track and baseball season to report on the transfer of a quarterback that averaged 106 passing yards a game last season.  

I'm going to see both Saguaro and Higley up close tomorrow afternoon; maybe they'll change my mind but I doubt it.

[golfaddict1]

1 hour ago, Wooderson said:

I'm going to see both Saguaro and Higley up close tomorrow afternoon; maybe they'll change my mind but I doubt it.

Will they be missing track kids?   Saguaro you could miss their 5 star recruit among others.  

I noticed Higley has 2 OOS games vs Cali with Moorpark and Paraclete.  Whatever the reason, whether it be scheduling needs with new 5A or Cali ties with the HC, now I like Higley more ha.  I didn’t see any OOS games for Higley in last 4 seasons.  

I dig OOS tilts.   Just looking at last year info briefly as not a clue what the Cali teams return or lose.  Paraclete could be a tough one if they are similar to last year.  The algorithm had Moorpark with a similar national rating as Higley, but who knows if true and it’s 2018 anyway. 

 

 

[Wooderson]

8 hours ago, golfaddict1 said:

Will they be missing track kids?   Saguaro you could miss their 5 star recruit among others.  

I noticed Higley has 2 OOS games vs Cali with Moorpark and Paraclete.  Whatever the reason, whether it be scheduling needs with new 5A or Cali ties with the HC, now I like Higley more ha.  I didn’t see any OOS games for Higley in last 4 seasons.  

I dig OOS tilts.   Just looking at last year info briefly as not a clue what the Cali teams return or lose.  Paraclete could be a tough one if they are similar to last year.  The algorithm had Moorpark with a similar national rating as Higley, but who knows if true and it’s 2018 anyway. 

 

 

I've seen their five-star recruit; kid with overwhelming physical tools that has yet to play anyone that can match those tools.  That's what happens when you play in the worst large-school division in Arizona history.

I like out of state games too, but not when they compromise the quality of football being played within the state.  It used to be the best teams between divisions played against one another-now we have Saguaro turning down big in-state matchups because the game likely won't be played on ESPN (what Mohns actually told Centennial when approached about a game in 2018).  That doesn't grow the sport on the most local levels, which is the only way the game is going to continue to flourish.  As it stands we don't have kids flocking to schools because of academics or even the quality of their football programs, we see them flocking to the schools that get the free trip to California or Vegas (see the program at Higley who's greatest accomplishment is playing Saguaro close).  

State track meet ended on Saturday, and considering this event is expected to draw numerous college coaches I'm guessing there won't be too many bodies missing.

[golfaddict1]

https://www.yurview.com/sports/high-school-football/saguaro-hopes-pick-six/

Another excellent writer :)   

Saguaro and Higley... destroying AZ football one oos game at a time lol (especially ESPN tilts).  

Is a Unicorn a 6 star?  

 

 

 

 

 

[Wooderson]

Couple VLogs from Thursday night's event, first one on Saguaro side and second one on Centennial/Higley side.  "Highlights" include discussion of Saguaro as having the best 7-on-7 defense in the nation, and a supposed legacy of great tight ends at Centennial that I'm not aware of (we've had one guy go D-1 at tight end in 25 seasons of varsity competition) when referencing a kid that was an X receiver last season.  I'd volunteer my opinions on the matter but apparently my track record of "never being wrong" when talking about Arizona football on here doesn't pass the mustard for some people.
 

 

[NotBigdaddybloom]

Stop saying Centennial!

[chalmetteowl]

On 5/7/2018 at 6:27 PM, FootballGuy said:

Man please! Lol. The main advantage elite privates have is the recruiting. More stability for them. Consistency as well. They should beat the elite publics 9 times out of 10. This is why I feel like it's a bad look for privates to lose to publics. 

yeah definitely not the case in Louisiana... elite privates should beat elite publics 6 out of 10 here, just bc some of our publics work with serious talent

but John Curtis has lost games that I can remember to St. James, East St. John, Karr, and O.P. Walker and they still kept on being John Curtis

[Wooderson]

2 hours ago, NotBigdaddybloom said:

Stop saying Centennial!

My posts on this thread have been far more about the idiotic hype surrounding Higley and Saguaro, thus as long as people who know "jack" and "squat" about Arizona continue to wax poetic about things they know nothing about  (and use the words of a known plagiarist to support their stance) I am going to continue to re-direct the Arizona conversation to something more closely resembling reality.

Edit:  I'm assuming you were referencing my exchange with Golf, if by chance you were referring to a different Centennial then disregard.  My point still stands if my assumption was correct (and if someone other than you reads what I've written).

[TheMaximumHornetSting]

11 hours ago, NotBigdaddybloom said:

Stop saying Centennial!

No. 

 

[sausmann9]

On 5/7/2018 at 1:11 PM, Pops said:

Is it a bad look when GA’s best team gets beat 56-0?

Not really when considering the opponent.

[chalmetteowl]

1 hour ago, sausmann9 said:

Not really when considering the opponent.

Vermont's best team should get beat 56-0, not Georgia's, ever.

[Pops]

12 hours ago, sausmann9 said:

Not really when considering the opponent.

Pray tell, what would be?

[Omaha Vol]

2 hours ago, Pops said:

Pray tell, what would be?

Same reason Chandler routed Miami NW last year. Do you really think the team that beat Miami Central twice last year was that bad? Or, did Chandler run it up just to make a national statement? Bear in mind, that Central team that Miami NW beat twice also knocked off Bishop Gorman. 

The BTW/Norcross aberration was akin to the aforementioned. Norcross was not THAT bad and neither was GA. 

[Pops]

4 hours ago, Omaha Vol said:

Same reason Chandler routed Miami NW last year. Do you really think the team that beat Miami Central twice last year was that bad? Or, did Chandler run it up just to make a national statement? Bear in mind, that Central team that Miami NW beat twice also knocked off Bishop Gorman. 

The BTW/Norcross aberration was akin to the aforementioned. Norcross was not THAT bad and neither was GA. 

Meh

i could say same thing about BG and FLs last year 

none of our examples are even close to your #1 team getting spanked 56-0 

theres a reason why Norcrossed is a verb

If that’s not a bad look, then pray tell what is — you basically said “shit happens” sometimes, and I agree (DLS played poorly and I think BG ran it up a bit ie)

but there ought not be any objections to 56-0 being a bad look — it’s #1 on the all-time list